A Game of Thrones **BOOKS OFF LIMITS** v2

[Finger Cookin]

That crossbow reveal was hilariously underwhelming, no doubt about it.

[Jbo]

Both awesome and hilarious at the same time

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Mike F

Well, a bit of forward movement in that episode, but, at risk of seeming like a hater (which I'm not; I love this show!), it was some of the most ham-fisted forward movement:

1. Jon is moving towards Dany, but one Evite has him running off alone to meet up with an unknown entity?
2. Euron has his gift, and the first big shot of the new war is fired, but an experienced fleet gets completely blindsided in the night with no warning, and Euron sails right up to the command boat unopposed?
3. Jorah finds his cure (presumably), but it takes Sam just a few hours search to discover the cure, and (again presumably) pulls it off despite it being too dangerous for even the most senior maesters to attempt?

I really hope the need to speed up the plot doesn't cause a big drop in the quality of the story that has existed thus far.

The thing that annoyed me was that while I agree that the sea battle with Euron was probably a bit restricted due to budgetary issues, it wasn't very well written. I'm assuming each fleet has hundreds of ships and you're telling me they managed to literally smash into each other without any kind of warning?

The scene with Sam and Jorah was great, but I think anyone could have written that better. Strange way of presenting it.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Azure

The thing that annoyed me was that while I agree that the sea battle with Euron was probably a bit restricted due to budgetary issues, it wasn't very well written. I'm assuming each fleet has hundreds of ships and you're telling me they managed to literally smash into each other without any kind of warning?

The scene with Sam and Jorah was great, but I think anyone could have written that better. Strange way of presenting it.

It seemed as though Euron was able to take advantage of some kind of fog camouflage. His boat emerged out of nowhere. I think the idea is that he learned all sorts of tricks during his time away from the Ironborn. That being said, a lot of things in that scene were done for dramatic effect and wouldn't have been overly practical. It's actually kind of a major issue with the show. I tried rewatching the first two seasons, and it just wasn't as good. A big part of the show is the reveals and the dramatic moments.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by FireGilbert

It was an average episode.


-Arya's reunions. She was once the best part of the show, then became the worst, and now back in Westeros she is the best again.

Why is Arya the best? There isn't much depth to her or her storyline. Doesn't want to be a 'lady'...bloodlust for revenge...willing to do anything to get it...that's about it. Since episode one. Clearly none of the lessons Ned had intended for her were learned.

She's still pretty insufferable and needs to be put in her place by someone, anyone. As much as Sansa annoys me, her character has had to learn and endure way more, which has given her humility and some measure of intelligence. Arya's just been running around doing whatever she wants, unchecked. Bucking the rules that were established for her. All the unanswered killing has to catch up with her at some point.

I also really didn't care about the direwolf reunion (except for that it was filmed near Banff when i was out there). Didn't understand the fans freaking out. If anything, I'm glad nymeria didn't join her. That was definitely a "nope" moment on her part. That would be my reaction too lol.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Why is Arya the best? There isn't much depth to her or her storyline. Doesn't want to be a 'lady'...bloodlust for revenge...willing to do anything to get it...that's about it. Since episode one. Clearly none of the lessons Ned had intended for her were learned.

She's still pretty insufferable and needs to be put in her place by someone, anyone. As much as Sansa annoys me, her character has had to learn and endure way more, which has given her humility and some measure of intelligence. Arya's just been running around doing whatever she wants, unchecked. Bucking the rules that were established for her. All the unanswered killing has to catch up with her at some point.

I also really didn't care about the direwolf reunion (except for that it was filmed near Banff when i was out there). Didn't understand the fans freaking out. If anything, I'm glad nymeria didn't join her. That was definitely a "nope" moment on her part. That would be my reaction too lol.

Ned's lessons were learned(from his death). Loyalty means nothing. Honour is not a thing. There is no respect. The 7 kingdoms is a viscous place, and you better learn to take care of yourself, and get your enemies before they get you.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Ned's lessons were learned(from his death). Loyalty means nothing. Honour is not a thing. There is no respect. The 7 kingdoms is a viscous place, and you better learn to take care of yourself, and get your enemies before they get you.

Yeah, shes the most visceral character.

Shes got her own code and her own brand of morality. Shes the outsider who watched people play 'by the rules' and sees where and what it gets them, usually killed.

So screw that nonsense, shes going to do things her own way.

Shes abandoned her father's principles, shes abandoned the customs of her house, family and station, shes abandoned the rules of the many-faced God.

Shes a Renegade. She does what she thinks is best and shes appointed herself Judge, Jury and Executioner.

I like it. Shes the wild card.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by blankall

It seemed as though Euron was able to take advantage of some kind of fog camouflage. His boat emerged out of nowhere. I think the idea is that he learned all sorts of tricks during his time away from the Ironborn. That being said, a lot of things in that scene were done for dramatic effect and wouldn't have been overly practical. It's actually kind of a major issue with the show. I tried rewatching the first two seasons, and it just wasn't as good. A big part of the show is the reveals and the dramatic moments.

What about a 30 second conversation between a couple guys on the Ironborn side about a potential problem seeing through the fog? Something like that could have made a big difference in developing the scene a lot more.

I agree a lot of stuff isn't practical. Just strange though that a show that spent so much time on dialogue now seems to want to go in a different direction.

[Regulator75]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

The point of the Missandei/Grey Worm scene was to show boobies. Nothing more.

[Oil Stain]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

That crossbow reveal was hilariously underwhelming, no doubt about it.

Like we needed to be walked through that one like it was some kind of revelation.....

"Hey there are giant things in the sky, What do we do?"

"Lets shoot arrows at them."

"OMG! You are genius!"

[saillias]

Fun fact about the conquest of Westeros by Aegon the Conqueror and his sisters, they never actually conquered Dorne. When they tried, the defenders skewered his sister's dumb dragon with a very nice ballista shot. Human engineering 1 stupid magic lizards 0.

Edit: I guess that's technically not show content but hope it's not against the rules. It's not explicitly in the books, but extra fluff from A World of Ice and Fire.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Why is Arya the best? There isn't much depth to her or her storyline. Doesn't want to be a 'lady'...bloodlust for revenge...willing to do anything to get it...that's about it. Since episode one. Clearly none of the lessons Ned had intended for her were learned.

She's still pretty insufferable and needs to be put in her place by someone, anyone. As much as Sansa annoys me, her character has had to learn and endure way more, which has given her humility and some measure of intelligence. Arya's just been running around doing whatever she wants, unchecked. Bucking the rules that were established for her. All the unanswered killing has to catch up with her at some point.

I also really didn't care about the direwolf reunion (except for that it was filmed near Banff when i was out there). Didn't understand the fans freaking out. If anything, I'm glad nymeria didn't join her. That was definitely a "nope" moment on her part. That would be my reaction too lol.

lol what in the hell are you talking about?

Arya has had her ass kicked since the beginning of the show.

She watched helplessly as her father had his head chopped off in front of her.

She waited helplessly outside while her mother and oldest brother were slaughtered at the red wedding.

As far she knew, Theon had betrayed her younger brothers which resulted in their deaths as well as her family home being taken over by the Boltons.

I also think that up until this last episode, she had no idea Sansa had escaped from Cersei's grip and as far as she knew Sansa was still basically a prisoner in Kings Landing.

All this was happening while she was a pre-teen girl living in a vicious world. But she was tough enough to find her way to a place where she could learn to kick some ass for a change instead of being just a helpless little girl, and in order to achieve that she had to have her ass royally kicked again relentlessly for an basically an entire season. She had her sight taken, was beaten mercilessly, left homeless living in the streets as a beggar, stabbed and nearly killed.

I don't see how anyone can begrudge her for wanting to dole out some rough justice to the evil people that she basically had to stand by and watch kill and/or imprison her entire family for basically what amounts to nearly half her life.

Also, she hasn't lost her values either, because as soon as she found out Sansa and Jon had taken back Winterfell she pulled an instant 180 and headed back there without hesitation, instead of continuing on to Kings Landing to kill Cersei.

[Oling_Roachinen]

My biggest gripe with Arya is how she traveled from Bravos, she got to the Twins, destroyed the Freys, was on her way to kill Cersei and hadn't heard about the King in the North. Her whole thing was about taking in everything, being prepared, resourceful, knowledgeable, and she somehow never managed to find out what was happening in Westeros over the months she would have been travelling?

Syrio and Jaqen would be ashamed of her.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

The point of the Missandei/Grey Worm scene was to show boobies. Nothing more.

Grey Worm is going to ####ing die. Need to pull on the heart strings a little more.

Also, Arya's pretty much gotta kill littlefinger at this point, yes?

[Party Elephant]

I think it's dumb that after having all his ships stolen in the last season, Euron just turns around and says "build a thousand ships!" and then in the short time henceforth he's managed to build a bigger and better fleet than the one that had presumably been built over decades.

[JohnnyB]

Lots that can be picked apart and criticised as they're running through so much content, but it's still enjoyable. If you've watched this much, might as well just take it in and enjoy it.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by Party Elephant

I think it's dumb that after having all his ships stolen in the last season, Euron just turns around and says "build a thousand ships!" and then in the short time henceforth he's managed to build a bigger and better fleet than the one that had presumably been built over decades.

Except they didn't steal all of the ships in the Iron Fleet, they stole 100. That's a lot of ships, for sure. But it's quite a lot less than 1,000.

https://youtu.be/Jw0Evc7JDoQ?t=58s

[KTrain]

No kidding. Suspend disbelief and don't let little details spoil it for you. It's arguably the best TV show of the last decade and it's more fun to sit back and enjoy the ride than pick it apart for plot holes.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by KTrain

No kidding. Suspend disbelief and don't let little details spoil it for you. It's arguably the best TV show of the last decade and it's more fun to sit back and enjoy the ride than pick it apart for plot holes.

I also think it's important to note that just because something isn't explicitly explained and seems like a plothole it does not mean that it is. I feel like a whole bunch of stuff brought up in this thread is explainable through small details that we missed on the show or by things that could've been easily explained but weren't due to either time or budget constraints on the TV show or it's just straight up nitpicking.

Back when the books were ahead of the TV show we could often fill-in a bunch of the gaps that people did not understand, although maybe not in this thread r not really obviously anyway. Now that that is no longer the case it is much more difficult for people to fill in those gaps to help things make sense for the TV show.

[DownInFlames]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

I also think it's important to note that just because something isn't explicitly explained and seems like a plothole it does not mean that it is. I feel like a whole bunch of stuff brought up in this thread is explainable through small details that we missed on the show or by things that could've been easily explained but weren't due to either time or budget constraints on the TV show or it's just straight up nitpicking.

Back when the books were ahead of the TV show we could often fill-in a bunch of the gaps that people did not understand, although maybe not in this thread r not really obviously anyway. Now that that is no longer the case it is much more difficult for people to fill in those gaps to help things make sense for the TV show.

I read a thread on Reddit (in bed) that made the actions of Euron's crew during the fight make a lot more sense. But it's book talk, and I don't want to feel the wrath of the spoiler Nazis.