Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[8 Ball]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Oh come on. I've got nothing at all against trades and would never devalue them.


It's that the government is grinding away at a rare, near unreplacable resource while also offering handouts of our tax dollars to bring in workers. And I'm not saying that's bad, I'm saying pay the oncologists. Losing any solely because they found monetary opportunity elsewhere in Canada is a major fail. Let's not do that.

You took a shot at the government calling for trades people…

[Sultan]

Or, if you read it correctly, he is saying that one is easier to replace then the other.


As well, trades and building ebb and flow.



Do you know what doesn't, and just keeps going up? Cancer ffs. Not to mention, the later it is diagnosed the less chance there is for survival, sometimes.



A building can wait, cancer does not. The more of that resource, that is available, the more lives will be saved. Or lost if it goes the other way and it takes 6 months for an appointment to see an oncologist.

[Harry Lime]

Alberta is Calling phase one calls for doctors, none came. In fact they managed to scare away doctors. New plan to sell nurse practicioners as mega-doctors.

Alberta is Calling phase two calls for emperor squirrels. Low nobility ground squirrels leave the province. Smith promises a slime free mud salamander in every home.

Phase three calls for trades people. What's going to happen is that untrained people will move here, be trained on the job and we get crooked houses. Book it.

[8 Ball]

Originally Posted by Sultan

Or, if you read it correctly, he is saying that one is easier to replace then the other.


As well, trades and building ebb and flow.



Do you know what doesn't, and just keeps going up? Cancer ffs. Not to mention, the later it is diagnosed the less chance there is for survival, sometimes.



A building can wait, cancer does not. The more of that resource, that is available, the more lives will be saved. Or lost if it goes the other way and it takes 6 months for an appointment to see an oncologist.

Buildings like hospitals can wait, perhaps hospitals that are existing can do without infrastructure upgrades. Your oncologist isn’t gonna provide you with infrastructure gas to help you breathe or provide you with heat and comfort. Maybe during your next appointment you can ask your doctor to provide you with plumbing to use the toilet or for lights to see where the #### you are.

[Sultan]

Originally Posted by 8 Ball

Buildings like hospitals can wait, perhaps hospitals that are existing can do without infrastructure upgrades. Your oncologist isn’t gonna provide you with infrastructure gas to help you breathe or provide you with heat and comfort. Maybe during your next appointment you can ask your doctor to provide you with plumbing to use the toilet or for lights to see where the #### you are.

Hey, don't get me wrong. Take away 50 percent of all plumbers or any trade would cause everything to shut down.


But that simply isn't happening right now, have you seen the wait times?


I wasn't trying to offend anyone.


And I wish there was more money for upgrades at the FMC or PLC, sadly money is the roadblock for building more than anything. Building more wings will not help if there is noone to staff them.

[8 Ball]

Originally Posted by Sultan

Hey, don't get me wrong. Take away 50 percent of all plumbers or any trade would cause everything to shut down.


But that simply isn't happening right now, have you seen the wait times?


I wasn't trying to offend anyone.


And I wish there was more money for upgrades at the FMC or PLC, sadly money is the roadblock for building more than anything. Building more wings will not help if there is noone to staff them.

It is happening right now, though, The shortage of people getting into the trades is going to hit us like a freight train. Just wait till you need a person to fix your furnace that goes out when it’s -40 and you can’t find one.

[Ozy_Flame]

Gotta say, I spent a weekend last month installing a water filtration system and redoing a bunch of copper piping for an off-grid property. I absolutely loved it, working with my hands rather than sitting at a desk was glorious.

Would love to see a grant or bursary program for mid-career people who want to switch to the trades.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by 8 Ball

It is happening right now, though, The shortage of people getting into the trades is going to hit us like a freight train. Just wait till you need a person to fix your furnace that goes out when it’s -40 and you can’t find one.

Is it happening right now? Or is going to hit us?

Because the cancer issue is happening right now. When my neighbour’s furnace went out this winter, someone was there that day. If my neighbour gets cancer, there’s already a 40+% chance they aren’t going to get the treatment they need when they need it, and that’s a life or death situation.

Nobody is arguing that trades aren’t important so I don’t know why you’re taking offence to the fact that cancer doctors are more important. Sorry, but they are. Yes, it’d be great if they could just focus on fixing both, but they aren’t doing that, so they should put whatever resources they need into fixing things based on priority of importance.

[Fuzz]

Clearly the government CAN do both(and if they can't, well, they are far worse than even I could imagine). So what I'm asking is, why aren't they? And it's not even that they aren't recruiting, it's they are actively working against the ones we have that is going to result in fewer of them. This is dumb.


/I love me some trades, since I guess that also needs to be said in every post.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Clearly the government CAN do both(and if they can't, well, they are far worse than even I could imagine). So what I'm asking is, why aren't they? And it's not even that they aren't recruiting, it's they are actively working against the ones we have that is going to result in fewer of them. This is dumb.


/I love me some trades, since I guess that also needs to be said in every post.

It really doesn't need to be added to every post, but the sarcastic put down of the trades people initiative was you and was unnecessary. Getting a response to that is 100% reasonable.

I mean, of all the stupid stuff the UCP does that was the thing you thought they should cut to find the $20MM to pay the oncologists?

Plus Alberta really does have enough money for both of those things.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

It really doesn't need to be added to every post, but the sarcastic put down of the trades people initiative was you and was unnecessary. Getting a response to that is 100% reasonable.

I mean, of all the stupid stuff the UCP does that was the thing you thought they should cut to find the $20MM to pay the oncologists?

Plus Alberta really does have enough money for both of those things.

I guess it came across differently than I had intended. I intended it as inviting trades is fine, but we have these other needs that are being bungled.

I'll try to Be Better.

[PepsiFree]

It’s really Fuzz’s fault for not remembering that Tradies are the most sensitive section of people on the planet. Save your sarcastic put downs for job categories that deserve it, like retail workers, you monster!

[8 Ball]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Is it happening right now? Or is going to hit us?

Because the cancer issue is happening right now. When my neighbour’s furnace went out this winter, someone was there that day. If my neighbour gets cancer, there’s already a 40+% chance they aren’t going to get the treatment they need when they need it, and that’s a life or death situation.

Nobody is arguing that trades aren’t important so I don’t know why you’re taking offence to the fact that cancer doctors are more important. Sorry, but they are. Yes, it’d be great if they could just focus on fixing both, but they aren’t doing that, so they should put whatever resources they need into fixing things based on priority of importance.

I’m not taking offence to anything, I disagree with you as I often do. Both issues are equally as important because they are.

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

Gotta say, I spent a weekend last month installing a water filtration system and redoing a bunch of copper piping for an off-grid property. I absolutely loved it, working with my hands rather than sitting at a desk was glorious.

Would love to see a grant or bursary program for mid-career people who want to switch to the trades.

Here’s some links to provincial and federal grants and scholarships. In fact tons of scholarships go unclaimed every year. At a baseline you will get EI while attending technical training for ~2 months per year, some companies will also pay full wages during this time but that is rare.

Also when you complete each period of technical training most companies (or their benefits provider) will fully reimburse you for the cost of the training ($1000 or so per year).

It’s a financial hit to start, but the pay ramps up decently. You’ll never be rich in the trades but it can lead to a pretty good standard of living, especially if you advance into an engineer / technologist role.

Edit: I should also add that when you go to technical training they also have lists of more locally based scholarships that won’t be posted on the provincial or federal websites. These are the ones that are rarely claimed as they are lesser known. Indigenous people have access to many additional grants as well, but I can’t speak to those too much as they didn’t apply for me.

https://tradesecrets.alberta.ca/appr...ncial-support/

https://www.canada.ca/en/services/jo...es/grants.html

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Alberta is Calling phase one calls for doctors, none came. In fact they managed to scare away doctors. New plan to sell nurse practicioners as mega-doctors.

Alberta is Calling phase two calls for emperor squirrels. Low nobility ground squirrels leave the province. Smith promises a slime free mud salamander in every home.

Phase three calls for trades people. What's going to happen is that untrained people will move here, be trained on the job and we get crooked houses. Book it.

Apparently the physicians have actually come calling based on the summary put out by the College of Physicians.

https://cpsa.ca/wp-content/uploads/2...-2023-2019.pdf

In 2023, Alberta saw 88 leave while 116 returned to Alberta. An additional 300 came from the US or internationally and 201 came to Alberta after finishing their studies in other provinces.

[Harry Lime]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Apparently the physicians have actually come calling based on the summary put out by the College of Physicians.

https://cpsa.ca/wp-content/uploads/2...-2023-2019.pdf

In 2023, Alberta saw 88 leave while 116 returned to Alberta. An additional 300 came from the US or internationally and 201 came to Alberta after finishing their studies in other provinces.

Huh, I live outside of Calgary and Edmonton, and all I saw was a mass exodus. I think that I'm right about the call for trades, though. There are a lot of new builds around where I live, and it's the employers hiring very, very green.

[8 Ball]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

It’s really Fuzz’s fault for not remembering that Tradies are the most sensitive section of people on the planet. Save your sarcastic put downs for job categories that deserve it, like retail workers, you monster!

I will admit to chuckling at this.

[Bill Bumface]

The oncologist thing is completely fiscally irresponsible, as well as being inhuman. Letting cancer cases marinate and progress means a ton of spending on long treatment courses that may not have been necessary.

This "sticking it to healthcare" schtick is verifiably insane. Sure, fix the system and make it more efficient, that sounds good to me. None of the actions that relate to employing doctors and nurses is accomplishing that.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by 8 Ball

I’m not taking offence to anything, I disagree with you as I often do. Both issues are equally as important because they are.

People dying of cancer = waiting a few extra weeks for a drywaller

[curves2000]

Anybody thinking part of the problem is how we have structed things here in Canada? Probably why hard working trades people who know how to work and know how to sell can make more than family Dr's and can approach some specialists?

Attracting and graduating trades people across the board is 100% vital to our economy and needs to be accelerated, waiting a few days for a plumber or HVAC or whomever really isn't the situation. It's how a lack of skilled labour hit's the economy and adds time, cost, complexity and more. This country has aspirations to triple/quadruple it's annual housing supply in short order. We are going to take homes/condos that are already slapped together quickly in garbage fashion and than proceed to accelerate that. Great!

As for the oncologist shortage and overall shortage of medical professionals in this country, Alberta and Canada as a whole need to wake up and quit the games. Amateur hour is over or at least it should be. I know this is a Alberta thread and the AB Govermnet's past and present have been absolute disasters in this regard, so has the federal government. We need medical dollars spent and we need mass amounts. The Canadian premiers were asking for something around $35-40 billion in NEW EXTRA money, the feds offered 10% of that. Jokers all of them.

Every medical specialist in Canada knows the Toronto God complex that occurs in that city with specialists. If your in Toronto and from there, your ok a lot if times. If your not? Your screwed. Your a specialist who run's multiple departments and top of class in your field in any major city in Canada? Odds are you may qualify for effectively a dishwasher job in your specialty in Toronto, not much more.

I am dating a top oncologist at the moment, one that has such extensive training internationally and in the US on advanced treatments. Treatments so advanced, they are not available in Canada, only G7 nation that doesn't have them. Why? Because Canada is a joke in this regard and it's well known. I am acutely aware of all these issues.

Nothing like getting recruited hard in the US and in Europe for substantially more money from top cancer centers globally, but struggle to get an interview in Calgary/ Red Deer, AB or in small town Ontario. Toronto won't even bother responding.