The Walking Dead TV show only thread- Part II ***See spoiler rules in first post***

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

Carol's character is a joke and has been for some time. Her transformation from battered house wife to She-Rambo was so unbelievably stupid. Now she's turning into a sad panda? Seriously? Worst character on the show by a mile IMO.

Really? So you're saying you like Carl or Enid better? Deanna's son Spencer? Denise, the doctor lady who recently died?

Carol's progress has been slow and deliberate, and she was going down a dark path without any checks to that progress. Now, after being captured and encountering another group that she could identify with, she's reflecting on the things she's done and realizes she doesn't like it. She's not so far gone that she can't feel guilt or remorse, but she still does what she has to for her survival.

I don't think it's a stretch at all, and I like it when characters change a little now and then. How boring would it be if they remained the same all the time? It'd be an episodic show with no story or character arc, and it wouldn't resemble the show as you know it now.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Really? So you're saying you like Carl or Enid better? Deanna's son Spencer? Denise, the doctor lady who recently died?

Carol's progress has been slow and deliberate, and she was going down a dark path without any checks to that progress. Now, after being captured and encountering another group that she could identify with, she's reflecting on the things she's done and realizes she doesn't like it. She's not so far gone that she can't feel guilt or remorse, but she still does what she has to for her survival.

I don't think it's a stretch at all, and I like it when characters change a little now and then. How boring would it be if they remained the same all the time? It'd be an episodic show with no story or character arc, and it wouldn't resemble the show as you know it now.

Most of those other characters are supporting characters, and haven't been given near the screen time Carol has. They are just sort of 'there' and weren't really developed at all, so they aren't a great comparison. The only main character you mentioned, Carl, I do prefer to Carol, by a wide margin. His annoyances can be explained as typical teenager stuff (in a ZA anyway). I find most teenagers to be annoying so it fits.

I like when characters develop and change too, I just don't find her transformation believable at all. She went from a broken woman who had never shot a gun to, seemingly, a fully trained marine within a 2 year span (as well as a cold blooded killer). Her attack on Terminus was so bad my eyes almost rolled right out of my head. She's a one woman army basically, it just doesn't jive with her origins. And now she's all sad and has to leave because she doesn't want to kill anymore? When did this epiphany occur and why? Some time between episode 13 and 15 is my guess. I wonder what the breaking point was? Killing the redhead and her group for kidnapping her and Maggie is my guess. Okay then, makes perfect sense. Maybe it was a magic number? Killing a baker's dozen worth of people is okay but more than that is just a bridge to far, and the only solution is self-imposed exile.

Just a dumb and completely unbelievable path she has travelled down. I know it's a show about zombies but the way writers have portrayed her is not realistic in any way IMO.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Is it as believable as Glenn, a pizza delivery driver who was pretty dorky, finding massive amounts of courage and resourcefulness in this next world, marrying the hottest girl available, and surviving countless scenarios where he probably should have died?

When you figure out the answer to that one, then, and only then, can you complain about the direction they've taken Carol's character.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Is it as believable as Glenn, a pizza delivery driver who was pretty dorky, finding massive amounts of courage and resourcefulness in this next world, marrying the hottest girl available, and surviving countless scenarios where he probably should have died?

When you figure out the answer to that one, then, and only then, can you complain about the direction they've taken Carol's character.

Don't get me started on Glenn's near death experiences this year. Low point of the the season in my eyes.

The other stuff is believable. What does him being a former pizza boy have to do with anything?

I could see him scoring a total babe like Maggie. There's not as much competition around and he's not a bad looking kid. I'm sure him being brave, trustworthy, resourceful, smart and good natured probably worked in his favor too.

[RW99]

I'm going to be that guy and say its Maggie, strictly from a logic point of view for someone like Negan. He didn't mention how hurt Darryl was, but he did point out how sick Maggie was. He wants (mostly) everyone alive to work for him. So someone who is sick and is a burden would be a more logical choice. And it would most likely be the most shocking choice to get his point across.

But those poll results with Glen...

[Radio]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm having issues believing how in one day of captivity she went from bad ass, take no prisoners, kill anyone to survive to a reformed person that can't stomach any sort of killing. Regardless of that poor bit of writing, the wild swings of the character have made her less interesting as who really wants to see more of this gentler, kinder Carol?

Very excited to see how far Morgan can take the Negan character as the team has lacked a really good villain since the Governor.

It wasn't one day of captivity, she's been having "problems" since around the time she killed the Wolf that was trying to kidnap Denise. It's been a slow build-up to this point.

I like the arc Carol has been on from battered wife to warrior princess. As for the believability of it, I have to believe if she didn't adapt and change she would be dead...as would anybody.

It's not hard to imagine, for me anyways, that a battered woman could be very adaptable. Being used to becoming whatever she needed to be to avoid beatings or misguide well intentioned people.

The short and sweet of it is Morgan got in her head and now her conscience is getting to her. But she also proved her point to Morgan, at some point you'll have to choose; do I save someone I love by killing someone else.

[Yamer]

Originally Posted by Radio

It wasn't one day of captivity, she's been having "problems" since around the time she killed the Wolf that was trying to kidnap Denise. It's been a slow build-up to this point.

I like the arc Carol has been on from battered wife to warrior princess. As for the believability of it, I have to believe if she didn't adapt and change she would be dead...as would anybody.

It's not hard to imagine, for me anyways, that a battered woman could be very adaptable. Being used to becoming whatever she needed to be to avoid beatings or misguide well intentioned people.

The short and sweet of it is Morgan got in her head and now her conscience is getting to her. But she also proved her point to Morgan, at some point you'll have to choose; do I save someone I love by killing someone else.

And let's not forget Maggie's pregnancy as a major catalyst of Carol's crisis.

[Da_Chief]

Sorry didn't the entire thread but I'm still trying to figure out how a bullet from close range to Carl's face doesn't kill him?

It was exciting to see Rick on his knees and not having a solution for once. Rick's new lady dies and he's having all these flashbacks and basically the next episode he's finally bedding Michone? why? just a waste. Should've left them as is.

I think it's time to move on from Carl, Sasha, Maggie, Eugene, Morgan. One by one they should be killed off. I hope Negan gives us a 2 for 1.

[Radio]

You won't find it in this thread either, but you will find it the previous thread.

It was a glancing blow that sent bone shards through his eye. He was not shot through the eye.

A lot of time has passed (months) since since her death and him hooking up with Michonne.

[Otto-matic]

Originally Posted by Radio

You won't find it in this thread either, but you will find it the previous thread.

It was a glancing blow that sent bone shards through his eye. He was not shot through the eye.

A lot of time has passed (months) since since her death and him hooking up with Michonne.

Yeah I think it was a time jump episode, they rebuilt the walls that came down IIRC.

I had a shower thought this morning, imagine the dynamic if Shane left Ricks group in S2 and joined the Saviors. Seeing Shane at the lineup would really throw Rick off.

[Radio]

That would be good, or if he was Negan.

There was a point where him and Andrea were talking about leaving.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Radio

That would be good, or if he was Negan.

There was a point where him and Andrea were talking about leaving.

I liked Andrea, there I said it.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Radio

That would be good, or if he was Negan.

There was a point where him and Andrea were talking about leaving.

It also would have been an interesting story arch because Judith could very well be his biological kid. We could have had The Walking Dead meets Days of Our Lives scenario.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It also would have been an interesting story arch because Judith could very well be his biological kid. We could have had The Walking Dead meets Days of Our Lives scenario.

Walking Dead meets Days of Our Lives meets Zombie Maurey Povich?

[Alberta_Beef]

As interesting as Shane with/leading the Saviors could have been, it would only work IMO if they stayed in the south being around DC would make that just too improbable.

[Otto-matic]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

I liked Andrea, there I said it.

I liked Andrea too, I was hoping they would have kept her.

[Alberta_Beef]

I wouldn't say I liked Andrea as I was mostly indifferent, but she never annoyed me like she did others.

[burnin_vernon]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Is it as believable as Glenn, a pizza delivery driver who was pretty dorky, finding massive amounts of courage and resourcefulness in this next world, marrying the hottest girl available, and surviving countless scenarios where he probably should have died?

When you figure out the answer to that one, then, and only then, can you complain about the direction they've taken Carol's character.

I miss that Glen. I don't like it when characters turn from every day people to super heroes. Don't we all agree the first Die Hard was the best?

The show could use some character versatility.

[dobbles]

I know I'm a week late to this, but put me in the group that thought the finale was solid. I liked the overall plot with the saviors always being one step ahead of the group. You guys have discussed already, but I think it goes a long way to getting the group to accept their subservient position. You really have to break their will to minimize the chance of rebellion.

I was not a huge fan of the long speech by Negan as it did drag some. But I think I read in an earlier post that it was from the comics, so it was one of those things they didn't have much choice on. The one thing I thought that Negan was going to do was make Rick choose who had to die. I thought that might have helped in the psychological warfare a bit. Wasn't such a huge fan of the eenie meenie method. However, I am totally ok with not knowing who got it. I feel like its similar to a magic trick. Everyone begs to find out, then when they do, they brush it off as trivial. If we knew who got killed, it would minimize the impact IMO.

I did also want to talk about Carols arc as you guys have debated that a lot. Personally, I did find it a bit rushed having her switch back to non-violence. I think they should have had her make that tally of human kills a couple episodes before the capture one. To show it had slowly been wearing on her. Because for me, before that episode, I still felt like the homemaker version of Carol we had seen in Alexandria was still just keeping people from knowing her true self. But I did feel it was fairly plausible for her to see how off the rails the Alicia Witt character had become and come to the realization that is not who she wanted to be.

With all that said, I felt the spring season was the best the show has had in several years. If anything, I think I had more edge of my seat moments than any time other than season 1. The finale might not have been great, but I don't feel it hurt the momentum the spring had. Hoping the new dynamic with the saviors and the weird people that Carol and Morgan met will make next season as good.

[Otto-matic]

I've been mulling over this idea for the past week, what if the Walking Dead crew reveals who got Negan'd in the Comic-con trailer. Season 7 begins with the aftermath and the new order.