[News] Calgary, Alberta, & CSEC agree in principle to $1.223bn Event Centre + infrastructure

[Yeah_Baby]

nm

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

CalgaryPuck is left leaning compared to general Calgary population (or at least the vocal posters )

Where on the spectrum that “left” sits - sure it’s more central then historic “left” parties

I hear what you're saying, but I feel like amongst folk I talk to in Calgary regularly in my age demo it's pretty run of the mill.

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

You trying to get called a socialism communist on CalgaryPuck? Because that's how you get called a communism socialist on CalgaryPuck.

Please the real Socialist is my Paladin Seegaar in my D&D campaign. Who is definitely not named after famous communist folk singer Pete Seeger.

Originally Posted by sureLoss

https://twitter.com/user/status/1651313448536649739

When your rival back you in the corner so you do the shadowy secrecy bit because you know on the slim chance you win you're going to match the funds away

[Red Slinger]

I'm happy they have an agreement in principle but like many others I have concerns around the cost to taxpayers.

And while I loathe Danielle Smith and the UCP I have the least concerns with the Provincial portion of the funding because it likely would have been spent anyways on the infrastructure in the area. At the end of the day, Smith just shoe-horned her way into this announcement to help herself in the election.

I would have preferred the actual arena/facility costs to be closer to 50/50. It seems like CSEC made out even better than the last deal.

I'm also quite surprised by some many so-called fiscal conservatives here that occasionally complain about their taxes raised for things like roads, hospitals, transit, emergency services, and other services that benefit everyday Calgarians. But as soon as it affects their hockey team and its billionaire owner getting public subsidies for one of his money-making ventures, they suddenly have no qualms about the cost to the public.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

https://twitter.com/user/status/1651309180089925632

[Ashasx]

just ####ing kill me

[Jason14h]

Wouldn’t the city have to be the ones giving secret development right Vs the province anyways ?

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

just ####ing kill me

Please the MAID thread is in off topic and doesn't fit here

[midniteowl]

My concern now is will our arena be better than the dump up north?

[All In Good Time]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

just ####ing kill me

Wait wait wait

Don’t worry!!

Originally Posted by All In Good Time

CalgaryNext - shot down before the presentation ended.
Event Centre I - shot down because of Covid
Event Centre II - shot down by provincial election

Let’s face it, we are destined to announce arena deals every couple of years till a new sports district is built next to the Grey Eagle

Originally Posted by flambers

Not going to happen, no matter who wins the election

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

(I wouldn't call Calgarypuck left leaning myself. More centrist classic Red Tory territory. But it's Calgary so I'm probably splitting hairs. the Alberta NDP aren't even really left leaning in any way shape or form despite their roots.)

Right wing posters should also be getting upset over this deal. I think there is a tendency to forget that Canada has been slightly left socially and slightly right fiscally for a lot of it history. Covid really heated up the left/right and urban/rural divides.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Her press conference is here:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1651308165991129088


Unfortunately she can't actually say much because there isn't much info to comment on. The fact the secret deal will all be revealed immediately after the election should make us all firmly question, "uhm, why?" A pillar of democracy is information. Without it, how can we make a reasonable call on this?

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Her press conference is here:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1651308165991129088


Unfortunately she can't actually say much because there isn't much info to comment on. The fact the secret deal will all be revealed immediately after the election should make us all firmly question, "uhm, why?" A pillar of democracy is information. Without it, how can we make a reasonable call on this?

I tend to believe them on this because it wasn't specifically addressed. If the city was coming out a winner on revenue sharing and was handling development around the arena then it would have been called out to soften the sweet deal CSEC got.

[Lanny_McDonald]

The conspiracy theories are starting to come out now. Always a great way to appeal to your wackadoodle base and feed their delusions.

[getbak]

Quite frankly, of all the secret side deals that could exist, the one that concerns me the least is who gets the rights to develop the surrounding land. All I know is, it won't be me and I won't be any richer or poorer regardless of who it is.

Is there any reason I should care?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Wouldn't those rights go to the land owners? Seems pretty simple to figure out who has the rights and who is going to benefit. Should be public record.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by getbak

Quite frankly, of all the secret side deals that could exist, the one that concerns me the least is who gets the rights to develop the surrounding land. All I know is, it won't be me and I won't be any richer or poorer regardless of who it is.

Is there any reason I should care?

yeah. your taxpayer dollars are going to Edwards so he can make billions more, and the UCP are hiding this until they get elected.

If he's getting the rights to all the land around the arena, he should have paid for more of the arena.

Oh well. When I'm collecting bottles to pay out of pocket for health care, it will be ok, as the Flames got a new arena out of it.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by getbak

Quite frankly, of all the secret side deals that could exist, the one that concerns me the least is who gets the rights to develop the surrounding land. All I know is, it won't be me and I won't be any richer or poorer regardless of who it is.

Is there any reason I should care?

They should be the sweeteners that allow the public to get a better deal. If they are just sweeteners with no benefit on our side, it would feel like a lost opportunity.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

If I'm following most of the justification for this deal, it's been:
- This is a great day, so shut up/stop ruining my vibe
- There are unnamed worse things this could be spent on, and named things like... an even more expensive arena
- It will have economic benefits beyond anything else the money could be spent on but there will never be any direct evidence of this so stop asking
- The money was earmarked for this so it was actually impossible for them not to spend even more of it on this
- This was inevitable, and it's actually your fault that it's so expensive now
- You'll get over it
- Flames stay

As I said last night, at $1.2b I would think there'd be more justification than various mixes of "shut up" and shoulder shrugs. But I'll be happy if the people excited about this promise never to complain about property taxes or the cost of things like hospitals, transit lines, or accessible community projects ever again.

That's definitely going to happen, right?

I think most everyone agrees there is value in the shared experience that Calgarians have by supporting a hockey team that competes at the highest level. It creates civic pride and togetherness. It is super hard to price that, and compare it to the benefit of improving services like busing, senior care or hospitals. A city does need some things beyond basic services. Just like every home needs some photos or art on the wall, even if times are tough.

What is hard to get over for some people is that the owner of said team can actually afford to provide an arena without any taxpayer subsidy, and still earn a nice return on his investment.

But the economic reality of pro sports is that owners seem to have the leverage to extract these kinds of concessions so what to do? Cities just try to get the best deal they can I guess. And right now, Edwards was able to negotiate himself a sweet little deal with some people on the other side of the table who weren't negotiating with their own money.

I couldn't agree more with your comments that some of the justification in here seems laughably simplistic. "Think of opening night!". It is kind of a turnoff, when in fact I'm generally happy about an agreement being reached.

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Wouldn't those rights go to the land owners? Seems pretty simple to figure out who has the rights and who is going to benefit. Should be public record.

There is city owned land in the area.

The last deal gave the Flames first option to buy the Enoch Sales land before shovels went into ground.

It also gave them first rights to buy the land which the Bus Barn sits on for 6 years after they moved into the arena IIRC but the city was not obligated to make that land available for development within that time frame.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

yeah. your taxpayer dollars are going to Edwards so he can make billions more, and the UCP are hiding this until they get elected.

If he's getting the rights to all the land around the arena, he should have paid for more of the arena.

Oh well. When I'm collecting bottles to pay out of pocket for health care, it will be ok, as the Flames got a new arena out of it.

Relax. Kids might have had to wait 18 hours in the emergency room and get treated in trailers outside of the Children's Hospital a few months ago, but the arena the millionaires skate around in for a few hundred hours a year is like... ugly... and the dressing rooms? yuck. And don't even MAKE me mention the concrete roof that sends chunks off killing 10-15 attendees during every event. That's real, man, don't look it up. Just trust me. Losing a couple kids to healthcare capacity issues is worth fixing this extremely important issue. Survival of the fittest my guy.