How is everyone dealing with their finances in this economy?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Inflation has seriously messed with Canadians’ heads. Especially those who have no adult experience of anything but the ultra-low inflation rates of the last 20 years.

Recent inflation rates

2023: 3.9 per cent
2022: 6.8
2021: 3.4
2020: 0.7
2019: 1.9
2018: 2.3
2017: 1.6
2016: 1.4
2015: 1.1
2014: 1.9


Now imagine we’re having this discussion in 1983

1982: 10.8
1981: 12.5
1980: 10.1
1979: 9.1
1978: 8.9
1977: 7.9
1976: 7.5
1975: 10.7
1974: 11.0
1973: 7.5

That doesn’t account for housing. But the fury over the cost of living and our recent bout of inflation seems excessive. Our parents and grandparents endured much worse for much longer.

If it doesn’t account for housing then it’s completely useless. It’s by far the most expensive thing in any persons life.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Zary's-Mustache

Thank Jesus my youngest is off baby formula too. You better hope the mom breast feeds because holy smokes has that ever got expensive. I spent close to $8000 the first year just on formula. Is it really that expensive to produce this stuff?

$650 a month on formula? You’re having us on. Was it produced from lactating pandas?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

If it doesn’t account for housing then it’s completely useless. It’s by far the most expensive thing in any persons life.

People in this thread (and across the country) are complaining about the cost of all sorts of things besides housing. The OP has a $150k mortgage.

Also, housing in 1982 was even less affordable than in it is today. 18 per cent mortgage rates will do that.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by GGG

30k a year on groceries is insane for four people. I have two teenagers we eat fairly well for $1600 a month and that includes all household cleaning / toilet tree / laundry stuff. How do you get to a 30k food budget?

The average Canadian family of four spent $16k on food last year - that’s groceries and restaurants together.

https://www.dal.ca/sites/agri-food/r...port-2023.html

Either the OP is extraordinarily extravagant and reckless with money, or we’re being trolled. The absurd figure of $8k a year on formula suggests it’s the latter.

[dino7c]

16K seems way low IMO

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Inflation has seriously messed with Canadians’ heads. Especially those who have no adult experience of anything but the ultra-low inflation rates of the last 20 years.

Recent inflation rates

2023: 3.9 per cent
2022: 6.8
2021: 3.4
2020: 0.7
2019: 1.9
2018: 2.3
2017: 1.6
2016: 1.4
2015: 1.1
2014: 1.9


Now imagine we’re having this discussion in 1983

1982: 10.8
1981: 12.5
1980: 10.1
1979: 9.1
1978: 8.9
1977: 7.9
1976: 7.5
1975: 10.7
1974: 11.0
1973: 7.5

That doesn’t account for housing. But the fury over the cost of living and our recent bout of inflation seems excessive. Our parents and grandparents endured much worse for much longer.

I was born in the mid 80's so I can't say I experienced the high level inflation from those days, you are right though, those years were tough. Today's rates are for sure lower but it feels.......different?

In my initial response I talked about how big business and companies have gotten A LOT smarter on extracting more and more money out of us than before. "Durable consumer goods" aren't durable anymore. Appliances, electronics, HVAC systems and more all have reduced lifespans and are extremely expensive to replace. Cars and trucks used to be very easily repaired and maintained with very little knowledge. A lot of men did their own oil changes and basic maint. These days an oil change, a brake job and a windshield replacement on a modern car can easily cost thousands.

The classic Gillette razor and blade business model has be applied to a million products and services that people think they need, but don't. We have also become a throw away culture for a lot of things, which is wasteful.

I do think we should be pushing back against some of these things. Poor quality products, planned obsolescence, corporate greed with services/products and poor government policy allowing these companies to exploit as well.

Things feel different now. When my grandparents and parents came from Europe in the 50's/70's, they worked very hard in low level jobs, but had opportunities. They were able to grow and prosper, just like a lot of poor immigrants did Today? Good luck. Nobody is buying anything of value or moving up the social class ladder after a few years of washing dishes.

[DoubleF]

I get what OP is saying. Feeling like I could be careless with my finances on occasion and be completely fine to going to scrutinizing the money I spent and still feeling like I live pay cheque to pay cheque sucks. Kids also amplified the finance strain a ton as well.

I had to totally change the way I looked at finances just to stay calm and ensure life didn't feel so hopeless.

Mortgage is a forced savings. Principal and equity is my money. My rainy day fund can't be idle cash and investments anymore. It's a HELOC or LOC.

I also refocused my finances. 10 years left on my mortgage. Short term pain, long term gain. Unlocking the mortgage cash flow will be huge.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by shermanator

My finances are great. While I think inflation is hitting people hard, a lot of people just simply don't know how to budget.

While my finances might be great but I also understand why it's not as simple as learning how to budget. For countless Canadians it's about what can I do without. Fresh veggies and fruit is not cheap and the same for beef, pork and chicken. People often have to buy frozen over fresh or look for discounted or cheaper cuts of meat. I spent 30 years working for Safeway and the price of groceries today is insane. I can't believe it's gotten this bad.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by GGG

30k a year on groceries is insane for four people. I have two teenagers we eat fairly well for $1600 a month and that includes all household cleaning / toilet tree / laundry stuff. How do you get to a 30k food budget?

Purely out of my ass tbf, I just figured a hundred or two per week per person

Originally Posted by Geraldsh

This is the light at the end of the tunnel that some people don’t see. It would be great if you could make maximum savings contributions early on like financial gurus tell you to but the next best thing is make big deposits after the mortgage payment and most of the kids are gone.

Yesh great for people like us, but if you're under 30 you're likely never getting a mortgage in the first place

[Jason14h]

Well there's two options

1. Make more $$
2. Cut spending

Recommendations on how to cut spending seem to be dismissed mostly in this thread

Sooooo.... Make more money is the only other option

Cost cutting is actually the best advice and where people on a message board could make recommendations

I saw early the post about $10K post tax dollars a year on vacations. Well over 20 years thats ~ $500K compounded you would have if investing at a average return vs vacations. Assuming you did that from 30-50 (Ill just assume thats prime earning period and when family vacations)

A person not splurging on $10K a year family vacations during that period now has $500 K that can generate 7% a year which is $35K extra income or rollover into future / requiring less contribution towards future retirement.

I'm not saying thats what anyone should do. It's your money. Spend it how you want. Whatever makes you happy. Just showing the math.

People need to make choices and sacrifices . That is and has always been reality.

Again - There are only 2 options - You will need to make hard choices either way

Cut Costs
Make more Income

(More post tax $$ would also help/be more 'income' but I dont want to turn this into a tax debate)

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Zary's-Mustache

I will just lay everything on the table. I have no idea how people are surviving out there. I am married with 2 kids and make approx 90k after taxes. Wife doesn't work.

My mortgage is pretty low at 150k. I can't seem to save any money at the end of each year. Feels like I'm working just to stay afloat. I do save some but it definitely isn't enough for any kind of retirement. I don't have any benefits or a pension plan.

Having said all that I know lots of people are even in worse situations making less and it always boggles my mind how people can even afford these big mortgages. I have a friend who makes as much as me but his mortage is 3 times mine. I really don't understand how he does it.

Inflation is insane. Grocery shopping is insane. Feels like everything is over priced. I counted 12 strawberries the other day for $7. My kids eat 12 strawberries a day.

This is more of a rant and don't really know the point other than how are people getting by out there?

I'm not.
for reasons, mine is the only income and I make less than 75K BEFORE taxes. (for a family, that isn't all that much)

getting rid of everything I can now for anything I can get for it, as I've "robbed peter to pay paul" so much, neither of them are speaking to me.

what little I have left I'm going to lose this year, while it seems most everyone around me is doing at least ok.

For most, it seems the struggle is having to cut back. A good day for me is not crying in my car after going to the grocery store leaving with less than half of what I hoped to get.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Inflation has seriously messed with Canadians’ heads. Especially those who have no adult experience of anything but the ultra-low inflation rates of the last 20 years.

Recent inflation rates

2023: 3.9 per cent
2022: 6.8
2021: 3.4
2020: 0.7
2019: 1.9
2018: 2.3
2017: 1.6
2016: 1.4
2015: 1.1
2014: 1.9


Now imagine we’re having this discussion in 1983

1982: 10.8
1981: 12.5
1980: 10.1
1979: 9.1
1978: 8.9
1977: 7.9
1976: 7.5
1975: 10.7
1974: 11.0
1973: 7.5

That doesn’t account for housing. But the fury over the cost of living and our recent bout of inflation seems excessive. Our parents and grandparents endured much worse for much longer.

My parents came to Canada/Calgary in 1983 with no money and couldn't even speak English. I was not even a year old when they arrived here. I honestly don't know how they survived here and we're able to find work. Within about 5 or 6 years they were able to purchase their first home here.

I'm pretty impressed by that.

[Zary's-Mustache]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

$650 a month on formula? You’re having us on. Was it produced from lactating pandas?

Have you had a kid lately?

https://shop.shoppersdrugmart.ca/enf...51&source=nspt

This lasts 2-3 days depending on your kids feeding.habits. you can do that math.

[Geraldsh]

Originally Posted by Zary's-Mustache

Have you had a kid lately?

https://shop.shoppersdrugmart.ca/enf...51&source=nspt

This lasts 2-3 days depending on your kids feeding.habits. you can do that math.

Yikes! No wonder the birth rate is dropping. Making that purchase is not an optional choice, nursing may not be doable for a variety of reasons.

[Zary's-Mustache]

Originally Posted by Geraldsh

Yikes! No wonder the birth rate is dropping. Making that purchase is not an optional choice, nursing may not be doable for a variety of reasons.

And that also doesn't include the ready to feed formula you have to use first few months.

https://shop.shoppersdrugmart.ca/enf...44&source=nspt

It's insane. My son was born during covid and I was having to go to different towns sometimes just to find the stuff. There was a huge shortage.

[Fuzz]

This isn't meant to be callous, but this is the start of the results of globalization in an overpopulated planet. There is no rising tide raising all boats. We have limited resources on this planet, which means an ultimate reduction in our lifestyles as others rise, competing for what is available. In short, this isn't going to get better.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by chemgear

It's going to take years/a solid decade to try to fix the affordability situation of housing and basic costs along with the sheer weight of adding a million+ people per year every year.

The only solutions to high house prices are lower house prices. What that would mean practically is that the 60-70% of Canadians who are homeowners, many of them sitting on decades of price appreciation would need to see their house prices decline or appreciate lower than inflation overtime. This is problematic because many Canadians massively overreached financially to get into their home and likely sacrificed retirement savings and/or others thought they were mini-Grant Cardone's and leveraged into multiple investment properties that depend on price appreciation higher than inflation to compensate for the cash flow difference between rent incomes and mortgage & other expenses. Those people all vote and are in the majority, so no party is actually going to 'solve' the problem because for many people the 'problem' is their livelihood.

What's likely more practical is that house prices don't fall in nominal dollars materially but inflation and devaluation of the Canadian dollar erode their real economic value measured in hard currency back to an equilibrium over time.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Recommendations on how to cut spending seem to be dismissed mostly in this thread

I only dismiss/criticize it because most of the people that bring it up seems to be implying that that is the reason for people's hardships. Yes, obviously if you're struggling, vanity and entertainment should be cut way back.

But streaming services and vacations aren't why people are struggling, they're struggling because nothing is affordable anymore, and it's out of their hands.

Your post is still completely right, it's just annoying to see people be dismissive of others struggle and blame them for it

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by btimbit

I only dismiss/criticize it because most of the people that bring it up seems to be implying that that is the reason for people's hardships. Yes, obviously if you're struggling, vanity and entertainment should be cut way back.

But streaming services and vacations aren't why people are struggling, they're struggling because nothing is affordable anymore, and it's out of their hands.

Your post is still completely right, it's just annoying to see people be dismissive of others struggle and blame them for it

Vacations are the first thing to go in my world. Luxury for sure.

I am talking about the expensive travel to another country all-inclusive vacations, not the spend time with your family camping trips (although they certainly aren’t cheap anymore either).

[Zary's-Mustache]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Well there's two options

1. Make more $$
2. Cut spending

Recommendations on how to cut spending seem to be dismissed mostly in this thread

Sooooo.... Make more money is the only other option

Cost cutting is actually the best advice and where people on a message board could make recommendations

I saw early the post about $10K post tax dollars a year on vacations. Well over 20 years thats ~ $500K compounded you would have if investing at a average return vs vacations. Assuming you did that from 30-50 (Ill just assume thats prime earning period and when family vacations)

A person not splurging on $10K a year family vacations during that period now has $500 K that can generate 7% a year which is $35K extra income or rollover into future / requiring less contribution towards future retirement.

I'm not saying thats what anyone should do. It's your money. Spend it how you want. Whatever makes you happy. Just showing the math.

People need to make choices and sacrifices . That is and has always been reality.

Again - There are only 2 options - You will need to make hard choices either way

Cut Costs
Make more Income

(More post tax $$ would also help/be more 'income' but I dont want to turn this into a tax debate)

You are 100% right.

My only response would be I've seen so many people cut costs, save money, be very prudent with their money and then just get sick and die at a relatively young age. My grandpa was like that and passed away at 64 without ever having lived a somwhat normal life. He would just save money and buy the slashed down vegetables and other food products. Then he died.

I just can't live like that. I don't want to be prudent then one day I can't do the things I love even if I could afford to easily. While it isn't easy right now I rather live like this then the way my grandpa did.

Everyone has their priorities and almost no choice is wrong.