[GDT] Flames vs Stars - 6:30 - SNet-Cgy

[flames_fan_down_under]

Originally Posted by Hockey_Ninja

I have a bad feeling that Burke will force Feaster to trade Sven and we'll regret it for years.

There is just no way this happens.

The Flames have invested a lot in Baertschi and they expect a lot out of him. He could easily just be left to his own devices and have zero accountability placed on him, but that would not be beneficial for the Flames or Sven long term.

Brian Burke, Jay Feaster, and Hartley all want Baertschi to become a solid 3 zone player. It's obvious he is skilled, and talented, but they need to instil the right mentality with young players on this team. It is a lot easier to teach a 21 year old, who is still learning the NHL game, something, than a 29 year old who has played in the NHL for 8 years.

Personally this is exactly what I like to see with the coaching staff.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Yeah I too really don't see a reason to sit baertschi. I honestly didn't see the reason he was sitting during the phx game.

I also don't buy that Glencross an Baertschi are two different scenarios. I saw an interview with Hartley on Monahan where he explained that of you're in the NHL you're expected to work and play like an NHL hockey player regardless of age.

I just don't see it. Hopefully whatever they are seeing gets fixed though.

You really don't see how Glencross and Sven are in different scenarios? You have to read between the lines sometimes on what coaches say to the media, but it's next to impossible to see how Sven and Glencross aren't in different scenarios?

- Sven is 10 years younger, just starting his career, isn't even an established everyday NHL player yet, with superstar potential and skill.

- Glencross is a vetran, established NHL player who has made it, who has a very definable top floor as a top end 3rd line talent or a passable 2nd line player.

I'm sure you see the differences in those two situations. The Flames are hoping that one of these guys could become the key cog in a Stanley cup win down the road and be a key memeber of the team to come. The Flames are likely hoping that the other guy plug a hole in the roster for the next couple of years and hope that he puts up decent numbers and let's us trade him one day.

Very, very different situations.

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by Goodlad

Does anyone have a link to the actual interview? From this is definitely doesn't sound as extreme as the tweets implied.

Nothing is ever as extreme as tweets imply. They're information bursts devoid of all but the most basic information, and have no context or nuance.

But people eat up news this way. *shrugs*

[blankall]

All about a message IMO. The team went 1-3 on the road trip. Sven is a good player to sit, because it shows the other kids that noone's guaranteed a spot on the team. Sven's play, while not a disaster, has been below his potential.

[CliffFletcher]

Hartley probably knows what he's doing. However, one of the things I dislike about pro sports is the established players have such big egos you can only use the benching tactic on rookies and fringe players. Glencross would probably flip out if he was benched, and we can't have that. Whereas rookies are expected to suck it up and take it. It's naive, but it would be nice if all players - rookies and veterans, $700,000 guys and $7 mil guys - really were all treated the same.

[nik-]

I don't get it, I don't even want to think about it because it pisses me off.

Meritocracy my ass.

[Icon]

Watching a game from the box is NOT a bad idea for Baertschi.

- makes him re-think his effort he's putting in (works harder when he's back)
- different view literally on how the Flames system is operating
- reminds him his spot is no guarantee
- tasty popcorn

I think this is a good move by the Flames, and I expect Sven will rebound from it.

As for the meritocracy... I wouldn't say he deserves a game off... but I really don't think it will hurt him either.

[StrykerSteve]

Originally Posted by blankall

All about a message IMO. The team went 1-3 on the road trip. Sven is a good player to sit, because it shows the other kids that noone's guaranteed a spot on the team. Sven's play, while not a disaster, has been below his potential.

What other kids? The only other rookie on the team is Monahan, everyone else has basically already been sent packing.

[LouCypher]

Our lines are getting crowded and you don't really want to cut Sven's icetime to 5 minutes when he could maybe just sit a game work with what the coaches are wanting out of him and use this as yet another good opportunity to learn. I wouldn't even consider this punishment for his play more a part of the learning curve that they want Sven to go through.

[foshizzle11]

I'm thinking a win tonight. They have been playing hard and will come up with the win.

Gio is a game time decision, so that's awesome.

I hope Stajan and Glencross can rekindle come chemistry and rip it up. Something has to help Glencross turn it around.

Flames win 5-2.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Icon

Watching a game from the box is NOT a bad idea for Baertschi.

- makes him re-think his effort he's putting in (works harder when he's back)
- different view literally on how the Flames system is operating
- reminds him his spot is no guarantee
- tasty popcorn

I think this is a good move by the Flames, and I expect Sven will rebound from it.

As for the meritocracy... I wouldn't say he deserves a game off... but I really don't think it will hurt him either.

All that is right, if he was playing poorly, which he isn't.

This is just ######ed.

[MisterJoji]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Hartley probably knows what he's doing. However, one of the things I dislike about pro sports is the established players have such big egos you can only use the benching tactic on rookies and fringe players. Glencross would probably flip out if he was benched, and we can't have that. Whereas rookies are expected to suck it up and take it. It's naive, but it would be nice if all players - rookies and veterans, $700,000 guys and $7 mil guys - really were all treated the same.

Just some food for thought, the last time Glencross was a healthy scratch, he went pointless in his next 8 games. Hartley probably knows this.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Hartley probably knows what he's doing. However, one of the things I dislike about pro sports is the established players have such big egos you can only use the benching tactic on rookies and fringe players. Glencross would probably flip out if he was benched, and we can't have that. Whereas rookies are expected to suck it up and take it. It's naive, but it would be nice if all players - rookies and veterans, $700,000 guys and $7 mil guys - really were all treated the same.

I remember Glencross being benches by Sutter at one point. In the interview he basically saidhe had no idea why it happened and didn't think his play at all warranted it (it did by the way.) Of course after that his effort was much better, but it had nothing to do with spending time in the press box.

[foshizzle11]

Originally Posted by nik-

All that is right, if he was playing poorly, which he isn't.

This is just ######ed.

This is relative. We, as fans feel he has been playing well enough to not have to sit out.

Obviously the standard isn't there according to the coach. He isn't doing what they want him to. Hence he isn't playing.

Accountability is great and I don't see an issue with this, it just better not become a trend for our young guys.

It is a two way street and all players should have to sit when they aren't playing up to the standard.

[Bonded]

I do not think Colborne has been better than Sven

[Saqe]

Originally Posted by foshizzle11

I'm thinking a win tonight. They have been playing hard and will come up with the win.

Gio is a game time decision, so that's awesome.

I hope Stajan and Glencross can rekindle come chemistry and rip it up. Something has to help Glencross turn it around.

Flames win 5-2.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by MisterJoji

Just some food for thought, the last time Glencross was a healthy scratch, he went pointless in his next 8 games. Hartley probably knows this.

That's funny. I remembered the same situation, but completely forgot he went pointless after that.

[Drury18]

Originally Posted by Icon

Watching a game from the box is NOT a bad idea for Baertschi.

- makes him re-think his effort he's putting in (works harder when he's back)
- different view literally on how the Flames system is operating
- reminds him his spot is no guarantee
- tasty popcorn

I think this is a good move by the Flames, and I expect Sven will rebound from it.

As for the meritocracy... I wouldn't say he deserves a game off... but I really don't think it will hurt him either.

You have obviously never sat in a press box. That popcorn is week old if you are lucky. At least in the Saddledome it is. Only newbies are dumb enough to dig into that stuff. The pop machine up there is even worse.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by foshizzle11

This is relative. We, as fans feel he has been playing well enough to not have to sit out.

Obviously the standard isn't there according to the coach. He isn't doing what they want him to. Hence he isn't playing.

Accountability is great and I don't see an issue with this, it just better not become a trend for our young guys.

It is a two way street and all players should have to sit when they aren't playing up to the standard.

He was playing fine. He's been on par or better than Galiardi, and outright better than Glencross and Colborne. Jackman has been a hot mess for two seasons, but he's back in there now. This is reminiscent of the garbage 4 minutes he was getting last year before he was sent down (except he was playing much better this time around), and Burke spouting off at the mouth before the season. Sending a message is fine, when it's deserved. Eventually this sending a message is going to mean nothing, especially when we keep throwing disasters like Butler out there night after night with no accountability.

[tvp2003]

Let's put things into perspective -- aside from Glencross, who else in the top 9 do you sit instead of Sven? David Jones? Galiardi? I suppose one of those guys could be bumped to a fourth line, but I don't think sitting for a game (which is all it is at this point -- one game) is necessarily an indictment against Baertschi.

I for one am looking forward to seeing Cammalleri - Monahan - Hudler. All three are averaging 1 PPG or higher (small sample size, I know). Could develop into a very dangerous line.