Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Go Back   Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community > Main Forums > The Off Topic Forum
Register Forum Rules FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-15-2022, 01:17 PM   #2201
PeteMoss
Franchise Player
 
PeteMoss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: SW Ontario
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CliffFletcher View Post
Sure. But that’s some of the richest agricultural land in the country.

It’s still not clear to me why we’ve decided economic activity in an enormous country of 38 million people should be concentrated in two or three megacities. With the technology we have today, shouldn’t geographical proximity to other workers matter less and less?
In theory it should change now since companies likely don't need to bring a lot of their office employees back to the office.

It won't change however until companies are willing to say this is our new permanent arrangement and people trust that they won't change their mind 3 months from now and try to bring them back to the office.
PeteMoss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 01:22 PM   #2202
PeteMoss
Franchise Player
 
PeteMoss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: SW Ontario
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason14h View Post
Back to my original statement - there’s ton of room for affordable housing - people just don’t want to live there !
There's room around where people want to live as well. Its not like the area around Toronto is just barreled up with housing.

But the land is either farm land or doesn't have any infrastructure to deal with an influx of people. If money was no object - you could make Toronto like 5x its current size. You don't have to fire people out to Saskatoon to find room. Its just expensive to built endlessly outward.
PeteMoss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 01:28 PM   #2203
Azure
Had an idea!
 
Azure's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Exp:
Default

Its not sustainable to keep building single-home dwellings at an astronomical rate to try and meet 'housing' demand.

We need more reasonably priced multi-unit projects.

Every single multi-unit project that I know of in Winnipeg is pre-sold before it is finished being built.
Azure is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Azure For This Useful Post:
Old 09-15-2022, 02:42 PM   #2204
timun
First Line Centre
 
Join Date: May 2012
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gasman View Post
Please Elaborate - There is no inheritance tax in Canada and you don't report it as income, so what exactly are they taking 50% of?

The estate would dispose of assets at the time of death, but that would be normally taxed but not at 50%...
Moreover, disposition of a principal residence at the time of death isn't usually considered a taxable capital gain anyway, so when it comes to housing most estates pay nothing in the way of taxes on them.
timun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 02:45 PM   #2205
Ozy_Flame

Posted the 6 millionth post!
 
Ozy_Flame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Exp:
Default

The "Missing Middle" concept is something we really need to catch up on, IMO.

Missing Middle Housing: Thinking Big and Building Small to Respond to Today's Housing Crisis
Ozy_Flame is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Ozy_Flame For This Useful Post:
Old 09-15-2022, 02:51 PM   #2206
timun
First Line Centre
 
Join Date: May 2012
Exp:
Default

Eyyyyyyy, nice to see someone else bringing this up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by timun View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazrim View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by I-Hate-Hulse View Post
It always amuses me to no end that many of the loudest voices in the "up not out" movement chose single detached/attached housing for themselves. Just as long as they themselves don't have to live in apartment style condo units I suppose.
Are you sure? It's easy to say that but "up not out" shouldn't fall exclusively into 500 square foot rectangles. If that's all they keep building for densification, don't be surprised when people are looking for a little more breathing room. 1200-1800 sq ft townhouses/condos/etc that can be lived in by more than 1 person would be appreciated.
This is what "the missing middle" is all about... https://missingmiddlehousing.com/
timun is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to timun For This Useful Post:
Old 09-15-2022, 03:01 PM   #2207
Ozy_Flame

Posted the 6 millionth post!
 
Ozy_Flame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Exp:
Default

I think the Non-suburban, outer core neighborhoods are going to be key to sustainable growth. In Calgary, think Sunalta/Bridgeland/RenfrewCapital Hill/Parkdale/Hillhurst/Spruce Cliff/Killarney/Glengarry/Altidore. These are the communities that are really going to need those Missing Middle solutions and capitalize on densified infrastructure, such as transit.
Ozy_Flame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 03:03 PM   #2208
SebC
tromboner
 
SebC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: where the lattes are
Exp:
Default

Missing middle is better than SFH, but is not viable as an alternative to truly high density where it is needed.
SebC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 03:07 PM   #2209
bizaro86
Franchise Player
 
bizaro86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by calculoso View Post
It is being eaten up all the time in the GTA and has only contributed to pricing increasing as (IMO) investors snap up new builds before real people can even look at them. The investors look to multiply their money during build (invest small deposit and sell for market rate) instead of a real family being able to buy at the lower pre-build price. Instead of a family being able to buy a house for $500-800k, they must pay the post build $1.2-2.0m+ prices. More supply won’t necessarily help, unless there are restrictions on who can buy (etc) - more red tape, not less.
I mean the bolded just isn't logical. If you increase the supply of something the price is lower than it would be without that increased supply, that's the first day of Econ 101.

However, when generations of people believe that housing can only go up demand becomes pretty inelastic and you get people buying on speculation. The easiest way to stop that would be to have a housing crash of epic proportions (US 2008-2009 style) but obviously there would be lots of collateral damage from that. The government has been trying to engineer a soft landing for housing for a long time, but national policy is a bad way to do that.

The 2nd tier cities don't need tighter CMHC rules and higher interest rates, and Vancouver and Toronto do. But supply and demand are local - if you added a bunch of zoned land supply to the 2 over valued cities you'd eventually see a price response.

Edited to add: more supply doesn't need to mean endless miles of cookie cutter suburbia. It means adding more land and then building complete neighborhoods with a variety of built forms. It also means making re-zoning to higher densities more feasible.

Last edited by bizaro86; 09-15-2022 at 03:29 PM.
bizaro86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 03:07 PM   #2210
calculoso
Franchise Player
 
calculoso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Ontario
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure View Post
Every single multi-unit project that I know of in Winnipeg is pre-sold before it is finished being built.
I wish there was stats on how many of these were bought by people who lived in them 5+ years vs those that bought them as flippable investments
calculoso is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 03:26 PM   #2211
AFireInside
First Line Centre
 
AFireInside's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure View Post
Its not sustainable to keep building single-home dwellings at an astronomical rate to try and meet 'housing' demand.

We need more reasonably priced multi-unit projects.

Every single multi-unit project that I know of in Winnipeg is pre-sold before it is finished being built.
How many are purchased as rentals? Or to flip. I know a lot of people who do that, especially the flip. Buy very early on, sell when completed. That has to be restricted in order to achieve what people are asking for. It won't be, so very little will change.

Last edited by AFireInside; 09-15-2022 at 03:30 PM.
AFireInside is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 04:28 PM   #2212
flamesfever
First Line Centre
 
flamesfever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Exp:
Default

nm

Last edited by flamesfever; 09-15-2022 at 04:39 PM.
flamesfever is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 04:42 PM   #2213
Azure
Had an idea!
 
Azure's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by calculoso View Post
I wish there was stats on how many of these were bought by people who lived in them 5+ years vs those that bought them as flippable investments
Most of the ones we've worked on are filled 50% before the ground is broke, and 100% by the time the unit is done, and the residents are generally longer-term.
Azure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 04:51 PM   #2214
timun
First Line Centre
 
Join Date: May 2012
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame View Post
I think the Non-suburban, outer core neighborhoods are going to be key to sustainable growth. In Calgary, think Sunalta/Bridgeland/RenfrewCapital Hill/Parkdale/Hillhurst/Spruce Cliff/Killarney/Glengarry/Altidore. These are the communities that are really going to need those Missing Middle solutions and capitalize on densified infrastructure, such as transit.
Yes, they are key. That ring of communities that mostly started as post-war suburbs but became inner-city neighbourhoods in the decades since are the most ripe for densification. Being that they mostly follow the street grid and have rectangular blocks it's much much easier for them to be redeveloped. Unfortunately they have some of the most vociferous opponents to it.

Neighbourhoods like Scarboro and Mount Royal are problematic because of restrictive covenants...
timun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 05:04 PM   #2215
calculoso
Franchise Player
 
calculoso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Ontario
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure View Post
Most of the ones we've worked on are filled 50% before the ground is broke, and 100% by the time the unit is done, and the residents are generally longer-term.

Very good to hear!
calculoso is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 10:01 PM   #2216
Party Elephant
First Line Centre
 
Party Elephant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Canterbury, NZ
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame View Post
The "Missing Middle" concept is something we really need to catch up on, IMO.

Missing Middle Housing: Thinking Big and Building Small to Respond to Today's Housing Crisis
Montreal did it so well:



Of course they had the advantage of being hundreds of years older than most cities in North America. Still, wish there was more of this in Canada.
Party Elephant is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Party Elephant For This Useful Post:
Old 09-16-2022, 07:06 AM   #2217
CliffFletcher
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: May 2006
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by timun View Post
Yes, they are key. That ring of communities that mostly started as post-war suburbs but became inner-city neighbourhoods in the decades since are the most ripe for densification. Being that they mostly follow the street grid and have rectangular blocks it's much much easier for them to be redeveloped. Unfortunately they have some of the most vociferous opponents to it.

Neighbourhoods like Scarboro and Mount Royal are problematic because of restrictive covenants...
Aren’t those neighbourhoods already being densified? Most of the properties in Altadore today are infills and new builds. It’s actually pretty rare to see an original home. Same thing is happening in Killarney, etc.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by fotze View Post
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
CliffFletcher is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to CliffFletcher For This Useful Post:
Old 09-16-2022, 10:07 AM   #2218
you&me
First Line Centre
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by timun View Post
Yes, they are key. That ring of communities that mostly started as post-war suburbs but became inner-city neighbourhoods in the decades since are the most ripe for densification. Being that they mostly follow the street grid and have rectangular blocks it's much much easier for them to be redeveloped. Unfortunately they have some of the most vociferous opponents to it.

Neighbourhoods like Scarboro and Mount Royal are problematic because of restrictive covenants...
But neither of those areas follows much of an easily redevelopable grid pattern. They can be considered problematic when we start running low on parcels in those areas.
you&me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 10:27 AM   #2219
_Q_
#1 Goaltender
 
_Q_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Party Elephant View Post
Montreal did it so well:



Of course they had the advantage of being hundreds of years older than most cities in North America. Still, wish there was more of this in Canada.
Thanks for this.

Curious on some of your thoughts. Would a neighborhood like Altadore here in Calgary be something similar to the ideal neighborhood?
_Q_ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 10:33 AM   #2220
TheIronMaiden
Franchise Player
 
TheIronMaiden's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: ATCO Field, Section 201
Exp:
Default

It would be great if Calgary focused on building up, and making more compact neighborhoods. but I think the suburban dream is just too pervasive.
TheIronMaiden is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:59 PM.

Calgary Flames
2023-24




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Calgarypuck 2021