Westworld: New original HBO series

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Yeah I didn't mean i don't understand the point of telling the story. I meant that no one knows where the story is going.

If we get to the end and William tries to have sex with Delores and she turns him down and laughs at his small penis and that turns out to be the motivation for him turning to the MIB and helping Arnold take down the park, I'm gonna be pretty disappointed.

I'm also not confused as to why the story might be told over many years. Understanding the characters motivations and desires makes perfect sense. It is now up to the show to make sure that the timeline theory reveals all that in such a way that makes it relevant and interesting.

If it turns out their interactions and motivations have no meaning then the timeline thing won't be good tv.

Overall, I think what they're doing is much better than some rehashed King Kong pets go wild type story. Like I said before, I'll reserve final judgment until I see the actual execution though.

[polak]

What I don't like about the timeline theory is why keep it a "secret"? Keeping it ambiguous adds nothing to the story and I think it'd be far more enjoyable and easy to follow the show if they told us outright that it's two timelines of the same character.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by polak

What I don't like about the timeline theory is why keep it a "secret". Keeping ambiguous adds nothing to the story and I think it'd be far more enjoyable and easy to follow the show if they told us outright that it's two timelines of the same character.

I kind of like the which one if any is MIB tension. Does whitehat find the maze and is "enlightened" and black hat goes crazy buys the park to find out. Or does something happen before that sets MIB on his quest. The ambiguity of who MIB is if developed properly can pay off as long as there is a good thematic reason for his transformation

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by blankall

I don't think they are going for the "shocking twist" angle with the timeline theory. They've made it too obvious for that. At this point it would be more of a twist if we're in one timeline.

I don't know if it could be said that the two timeline theory is "obvious"

No way i would've picked it up without looking on reddit post-epi discussions.

Im sure most people watching who don't seek answers on the internet are completely unaware of the connection.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Cappy

I don't know if it could be said that the two timeline theory is "obvious"

No way i would've picked it up without looking on reddit post-epi discussions.

Im sure most people watching who don't seek answers on the internet are completely unaware of the connection.

Agreed.

I know a number of people who are not frequent internet readers and with the exception of some talk at the water cooler wouldn't have discuss the show a ton. They have no idea that there may be multiple timelines in play. I have decided not to spoil it for them as I think it may be more fun to not know. Heck, I kind of wish I didn't know but between reading CP and surfing the web pretty frequently I've had a number of articles with spoilerish titles get posted on my google news page.

Despite the internet's fascination with it and a few people proclaiming it is hit-you-in-the-face obvious, most people wouldn't in a million years notice that the logos were different or pick up on some of the other super subtle hints.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Cappy

I don't know if it could be said that the two timeline theory is "obvious"

No way i would've picked it up without looking on reddit post-epi discussions.

Im sure most people watching who don't seek answers on the internet are completely unaware of the connection.

When you look at who the producers are and the degree to which their former works have been dissected frame by frame, they are being obvious. They might as well have put giant flashing neon lights. They knew full well the fandom would pick up on the hints immediately.

[Party Elephant]

Yeah if it weren't for this thread discussing I wouldn't have considered the multiple timelines theory. To be honest I don't really care for plot theories and speculation as I think they take away from the fun of just watching the events unfold on the show.

[GGG]

I wouldn't have noticed the logos but time was messed
Up from the start with the android interviews so once you notice that you start seeing the other thematic parts. Though I'm not sure I would have got to White hat MIB until whitehat startet shooting people.

[photon]

Not sure if it's been mentioned, just watched the episode and when Bernard is searching for anomalies, the computer reports 5 additional ones found, but when Bernard goes to check it out, there's 4 hosts and Ford. Unless the dog counts.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by blankall

When you look at who the producers are and the degree to which their former works have been dissected frame by frame, they are being obvious. They might as well have put giant flashing neon lights. They knew full well the fandom would pick up on the hints immediately.

No, being obvious was having consistent transitions to flashbacks and flash forwards in Lost. Those were giant flashing neon signs. Being obvious was having The Machine and Samaritan review archived footage with date stamps when a flashback was being shown in Person of Interest. Those were giant flashing neon signs. Both shows from the producers of this show, both that didn't try to hide timelines for some silly "gotcha" reveal down the line.

Originally Posted by photon

Not sure if it's been mentioned, just watched the episode and when Bernard is searching for anomalies, the computer reports 5 additional ones found, but when Bernard goes to check it out, there's 4 hosts and Ford. Unless the dog counts.

The dog was built, no reason to think it wouldn't count.

[GGG]

I think I said this earlier in the thread but we view the show through the Androids lens in terms of information.

We know what Bernard knows, what Delores and Maeve see. So from the robot point of view they are trapped in time loops and don't have an anchor for when now is. By offering clues to the viewer its much like the robots reveries as they slowly gain consciousness.

And if you look at the MIB storyline we only know what Laurence and now Teddy see.

[badradio]

Music for episode 6 was A couple Radiohead songs. Fake plastic trees and Motion picture soundtrack.

My theory is Bernard is Arnold (in robot form). I'm glad to see others have that theory as well... good call on the anagram, when he said his full name I was wondering that as well...

Anyone know if this is an on-going series or is it over in 12 episodes?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

It is only 10 episodes but it will have more seasons.

[getbak]

Back in January, they shut down production for two months so that the showrunners could catch up on the scripts for the final episodes and map out a plan for the future of the series. In that time, they came up with a rough plan for a 5-7 season total run.

I believe that this week's episode is the first one shot after the shutdown (although, I don't know if they reshot/reworked any of the previous episodes during the shutdown to fit with the longer plan).

[Cecil Terwilliger]

it wasn't quite as simple as they just took a short hiatus to plan the future. They took a break to make sure the show could avoid disaster. There were lots of rumours the production was a mess, was way over budget and that it would be another HBO flop like Vinyl.

Late last year, HBO stopped work on the pricey J.J. Abrams-produced Westworld, based on a 1970's sci-fi movie series. and with an enormous cast including Anthony Hopkins and Ed Harris. Initially produced with Warners' TV production arm, HBO took back control after what sources call clashes with creator Jonathan Nolan, whose TV credit is the WBTV-produced Person of Interest on CBS. (HBO usually makes its own programming but works with Warners on The Leftovers.) Nolan is said to be every bit as controlling as his filmmaker brother Chris. Sources say cuts came in slowly, scripts started running behind, and it became apparent that episodes already shot needed tweaks requiring additional filming. Since stopping production, HBO persuaded Nolan to "put aside his ego," one source says, and has brought in two additional producers and two more writers. Production is set to resume in March.

"Westworld is wildly ambitious — on the page and on set," says Nolan. "In broadcast TV, it's been routine for us to write and shoot at the same time. This is a completely different animal. As we got closer to the final episodes, we realized we needed to take a break from shooting to catch up on writing. HBO and WBTV have been incredibly supportive throughout the process. It would have been literally impossible to make this show anywhere else."

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...stworld-868605

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by GGG

I wouldn't have noticed the logos but time was messed
Up from the start with the android interviews so once you notice that you start seeing the other thematic parts. Though I'm not sure I would have got to White hat MIB until whitehat startet shooting people.

I noticed that the android interviews weren't making sense timewise right away, but I assumed that it was just bad storytelling. When you have a critically revered show like Game of Thrones where Littlefinger can travel across a continent as if he had a jetpack or teleporter and Arya can heal from multiple stab wounds like she is Wolverine, you start to assume that every show is just playing fast and loose with logic and internal consistency. I was enjoying Westworld despite what I took to be storytelling lapses. When I heard about the multiple timelines thing and rewatched the series looking for it, it now seems obvious. And now I think the show is amazing, probably the best I've seen in years.

Hopefully they follow through now and the rest of the season is as awesome as the first 6 episodes have been. If they can, then Westworld could end up being one of the best shows ever.

If anyone is interested, I found some great write ups that explain the timeline theories and other theories on vanityfair.com that I highly recommend.

[Finger Cookin]

Not sure where it will end up on the best shows ever ranking -- but I think we can all agree it's better than Vinyl.

[getbak]

Vinyl was the rare HBO show that I had no interest in watching.

[ResAlien]

Damn no one's watched tonight's episode yet? Some theories definitely confirmed.

[The Fonz]

William is definitely MIB. He's becoming obsessed with the park, and "what does it all mean?". He also said he can never go back to his fake life.

I'm wondering if corporate is Logan's family's company.