Has anyone upgraded from an old furnace?

[GoinAllTheWay]

We live in an older condo that's around 40 yrs old and still on the original furnace.

Furnace apparently suffered a malfunction of sorts over the summer, it refuses to fire. Pretty sure it's the gas control valve.

I think it's on its last legs. I like the older furnaces as they are easy to maintain but there is some corrosion starting to form and I think my hand will be forced.

I've been told to stay away from high efficiency and instead look for mid? Pretty sure any new furnace also requires its own air supply directly from outside so I'm worried about cost/disruption/modification to the basement.

Has anyone had to deal with this? How did it go? What were costs like?

[Nufy]

I had my original furnace and th current water tank replaced about 5 years ago through direct energy.

They had a promotion that allowed me to pay off the bill over a year interest free if I did both. Only really needed the furnace but upgraded both at the same time.

Installer used the existing exhaust pipe for the water heater but had to add two (2) PVC pipes for the furnace. 1 combustion air inlet, 1 exhaust.

Total cost for both was about 5 k I think. Don't quote me thoug as it was 5 years ago and I'm getting old.

I would check to see if enmax / your provider has a similar program.

For my case the guy was in and out in a day. Took all the crap with him when he left.

[Fuzz]

I had an old furnace, the heat exchanger was starting to go. Yours probably isn't far from that given its age.

I got high efficiency, it was maybe 7 years ago when there were tons of government rebates, so it was almost the same price as mid. The nicest part is the high efficiency brush-less fan unit, as it uses minimal power, but I can run it most of the time. It circulates cool are from the basement in the summer, and keeps the basement warmer in the winter. Without the brush less motor, your energy bills will be high if you do that. So hat was one big benefit with the high efficiency, though maybe the mid ones have that now too.

They did have to run fresh air lines, they will find the best location when you get your estimate. One other thing I got was an electronic damper that only opens when the furnace is on, so cold air doesn't seep in in the winter and hot air in the summer when circ is on. Well worth it.

In the end, becuase I run the fan all the time my energy bills actually came out about even, but the house is more comfortable.

[Dynamic]

I'm not 100% sure but I'm not sure if they even make mid efficiency for sale here anymore. Anyways I had a huge old furnace that was 25 years old. It still worked but the bearings on the fan always failed and the thing was huge and loud. My new furnace is about a 1/3 of the size and apart from a few pressure switch issues it has been reliable for 4 years now. Nice and quiet I got the lennox elite el93 IIRC. My gas bills are down 20-30% than they were with my old beast of a furnace.

They did run new intake and exhaust lines out the side of my basement and they has to install a liner in my old furnace chimmney so it was not oversized for my water heater. It was 6700 bucks all in.

[I-Hate-Hulse]

You can't event buy a mid efficiency furnace any more, they are banned by law.

I'm waiting for rebates to pop up again before replacing mine.

[dubc80]

I just had this done last Thursday.

My old furnace was from the early 1970's. It was an old Flamemaster. I had it cleaned and the heat exchangers inspected every year to ensure they were ok.

Replacing it before this winter was more of a preemptive strike more than anything. I did fist pumps every year that the ole' beast made it through another winter. I didn't want to be "that guy" and have to call for emergency services at 2am on the coldest night in February and have it replaced at any cost. Plus, I'm a dad now with a 1-year old at home. Didn't want any furnace issues this winter.

I ended up paying just under $5000 for 92% 60,000 BTU high efficiency furnace and new 40gal hot water tank installed. This included some coring of my foundation which was required for fresh air intake and exhaust, new thermostat, another CO detector, and also included the city permit.

You can't buy mid efficiencies anymore.

The quotes varied from just under $5K to just over $7K. I had 4 companies come quote. From one man operators to the big chains you see in the advertisements.

Also, since you're in a condo give the condo board a shout. They will have some instructions on how they want the venting done.

I had Keith (Everlast), the resident CP furnace cleaner give me some recommendations on brands based on quality, ease of maintenance, etc.

From the top of my head:
Good: Carrier, Bryant, Trane, American Standard
Bad: Lennox, Amana, Goodman

Maybe he can chime in with more details on brands and models.

Hope this helps.
PM me if you have some more questions.

[prarieboy]

Originally Posted by GoinAllTheWay

We live in an older condo that's around 40 yrs old and still on the original furnace.

My friends old furnace failed during the night and his entire family was very nearly killed by Carbon Monixide. If you do nothing else get a Carbon Monoxide Detector if you don't already have one.

[GoinAllTheWay]

Originally Posted by prarieboy

My friends old furnace failed during the night and his entire family was very nearly killed by Carbon Monixide. If you do nothing else get a Carbon Monoxide Detector if you don't already have one.

Hmm, that's a pretty good idea actually.


Thanks for the input so far. As Fuzz said, my heat exchanger is what's showing the corrosion and pretty sure that's what's going to make me upgrade. That and I hate buying the stupid hammock style filters, they are getting hard to find and no where near the same number of choices you get with the newer cartridge style ones.

As far as the condo board goes, good idea on giving them a shout too although I suspect there is only really one way they could run the air intake as it's in a room that has 1 exterior wall, it's the only way they could do it. I would assume they could re-use the existing chimney the current furnace uses for the exhaust.

Surprised Lennox is on the bad list dubc80, my current one is a lennox but obviously an older model. Will contact Keith for sure for some replacement suggestions.

[dubc80]

Yeah, it was news to me too. I thought they were great.

I asked 3 other industry people about Lennox and they all said to stay away. Has to do with their parts being expensive and hard to maintain. Said their units suck, and they're basically all advertising/marketing.

I mean, how could you say no to this guy?

[para transit fellow]

Originally Posted by GoinAllTheWay

We live in an older condo that's around 40 yrs old and still on the original furnace.

Furnace apparently suffered a malfunction of sorts over the summer, it refuses to fire. Pretty sure it's the gas control valve.

I think it's on its last legs. I like the older furnaces as they are easy to maintain but there is some corrosion starting to form and I think my hand will be forced.

I've been told to stay away from high efficiency and instead look for mid? Pretty sure any new furnace also requires its own air supply directly from outside so I'm worried about cost/disruption/modification to the basement.

Has anyone had to deal with this? How did it go? What were costs like?

in the short term... is it the gas control valve or the thermacouple for the gas control valve? thermocouple might be burnt out.

They are fairly easy to replace

[GoinAllTheWay]

Pretty sure it's not the thermocouple. My understanding is if they fail, the pilot light should go out. To test it, I actually blew it out and let the gas continue to run and listened for the valve to close which it did and could not hear the gas running anymore. Waited till it cooled completely and attempted to re-light it and had no issues. Someone suggested cleaning the tip of it up a bit so may try that tonight.

[GoinAllTheWay]

Originally Posted by dubc80

Yeah, it was news to me too. I thought they were great.

I asked 3 other industry people about Lennox and they all said to stay away. Has to do with their parts being expensive and hard to maintain. Said their units suck, and they're basically all advertising/marketing.

I mean, how could you say no to this guy?

Well, good to know. If that many people are saying to stay away from them I will. I have no experience with modern furnaces so I'll listen to what the experts say.

[GoinAllTheWay]

double post....

[You Need a Thneed]

I replaced the original furnace in my house just after taking possession of it last year. The home inspection found a cracked heat exchanger (which finding parts for would likely be rediculously hard), so I got some money off the purchase price so I could get the furnace replaced.

New Trane 95% efficiency furnace, humidifier, fancy Honeywell Wifi Thermostat (can control everything on only two wires to the thermostat - Which Nest can't do), and bring the old exhaust (now only used for the hot water tank) up to code by relining it.

All together was about $5200 I think.

[GoinAllTheWay]

So basically I'm looking at $5k all in, that's not terrible and about what I was expecting. Now I just need to check out models and what company to use.

Thanks for the info all!

[Nufy]

Don't for get to check for gov't rebates as well.

I was able to get mine after I could prove it was fully paid for.

Took a year but I got a couple hundred back I think.

[Fuzz]

FWIW I got a TRANE XV95 and it has been flawless. 96.7 energuide rating.

[Flames-FanAttic]

As a tradesman in the industry and an owner of a small HVAC business, I can tell you that upgrading your furnace from a mid that is 40 years old to a high efficiency furnace will save you money just in the cost of running it. Your 40 year old furnace at the moment is probably running about 72 cents on the dollar, while the models now a days are running anywhere between 92 to 97 cents on the dollar. It may take a little bit but you will end up getting your money back in efficiency. As far as brands go, Its all about the warranty. I have serviced many different brands and it really comes down to when they were manufactured. Sometimes you have a well respected brand that has had a bad batch of products, its like anything else.

Depending on what needs to be done. Your cost could be anywhere from 3500-5000.

Things I look out for when I quote a furnace replacement:

How far do I have to run the new venting? 2-3" Plastic Pipe (out the side of your house, back, or through the roof)
Is your mechanical room on an outside wall?
Was your furnace undersized or oversized?
What efficiency do you want (92%-97%)
Do you have a floor drain near your furnace? (New furnaces condensate and drain water)

There are quite a few factors that go into quoting a furnace, these are just some basic questions that set the parameter for the price.

If anyone has any questions regarding a replacement or new installs for a Furnace or A/C, I would be happy to answer them.

[ricosuave]

Great info, thanks all!

[bootsnixon]

Piggy-backing on a good thread. Would these $ numbers and venting, mechanical considerations apply for a boiler replacement as well? Thanks