Trump vs. Clinton

[DuffMan]

I've heard many times from many people that Hillary was corrupt and flawed, and it was her own fault she did not win the election.

I'd like anyone to explain ...

1. What should she have done/done differently, to win the election?

2. How was/is she flawed/corrupt.

Feel free to include links to your sources, ie, Fox news, Breitbart, Infowars, World News Daily etc.

[Northendzone]

will quotes from the onion be allowed?

I thought that each candidate had their own warts and in the end it likely came down to who did you not want to vote for.

all that being said, it is hard to imagine an administration being run by Hilary, that would be anything like what trump has provided in the last 110 days.

[bc-chris]

i'm still in awe that in a country of around 330,000,000 people that trump and clinton were the two choices to lead

[Looch City]

I fully expect Trump to make an account on CP and contribute to this thread.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by Iggy City

I fully expect Trump to make an account on CP and contribute to this thread.

Or Spicey or Kelly Anne

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

2. How was/is she flawed/corrupt.

Well there's the whole Juanita Broaddrick stuff and how Hilary tried to silence her, you know if you believe the alleged rape victim.

Fortunately, as Hilary has recently told us, we should believe potential rape victims until we have reason not to, and we have no reason not to believe Broaddrick.

[Oling_Roachinen]

I do think framing it as Trump vs Clinton is maybe a mistake. Sanders vs Clinton makes more sense to me, and unlike those other two, he seemed like a genuinely good guy.

You have the DNC actively working for Clinton, her being told debate questions in advanced. It's not hard to see how otherwise Liberal supporters were disenchanted by the DNC.

[CaptainCrunch]

I think she ran a poor ground game and took too many states for granted.

I also think that the messaging that she had was wrong, not in terms of her speeches but her optics. She looked way too insider and way to 1% and I believe that Trump was effective in using that.

I do agree with the post above that both candidates were very poor.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I think she ran a poor ground game and took too many states for granted.

well, here's my take on that, unless she was willing to tell the gullible, what they wanted to hear, regardless of how grounded in reality it was, she wound't have gotten their votes anyways.
bringing back coal jobs, and returning America to the prosperity of the 50's, when union workers were making tons of money, twisting bolts, in Ford plants, is simply not going to happen. There's nothing her or Trump can do about it, but voters were willing to vote for the snake oil salesman, for a dream he sold them.

[Ozy_Flame]

One had celebrity, the other didn't. That's basically what it would come down for average voters. Trump had the advantage of having The Apprentice on TV for multiple seasons, and people saw that as good business acumen.

Don't believe me? If Dwayne Johnson ran for the Democratic nomination in 2020, he'd probably win.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

well, here's my take on that, unless she was willing to tell the gullible, what they wanted to hear, regardless of how grounded in reality it was, she wound't have gotten their votes anyways.
bringing back coal jobs, and returning America to the prosperity of the 50's, when union workers were making tons of money, twisting bolts, in Ford plants, is simply not going to happen. There's nothing her or Trump can do about it, but voters were willing to vote for the snake oil salesman, for a dream he sold them.

It's not inconceivable to get back to the 50's level of growth. It's not just about workers making more money, back in those days business tax rates were significantly higher and companies weren't outsourcing work at anywhere near the rates they are today. These concepts aren't about stopping businesses from making money or making a lot of money, they're about maintaining overall domestic economic growth.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Is all this just a case of lots of smoke and no fire? Even if your other side of the truth is totally correct what does it matter? She still lost to a candidate that couldn't win a spelling bee against an 8 year old let alone a presidential election. Countless polls even during the democratic primary's showed up to 60% of Americans didn't trust her, Trump's team slammed her perceived lack of honestly and trustworthiness to death. Trump could get on stage and lie threw his teeth and still win the polls against her for this.

Since it's your belief Clinton was the next snow white how about explaining your reason how she could ever loose to that crazy idiot.

You're moving goal posts and creating straw men. She's not snow white and She lost for a variety of reasons:

1) Decades of demonization as evidenced above
2) Personality
3) Comey letter
4) tactical errors
5) being female
6) macro level political movements (ecumbent party, economic issues,etc)


Yes it's smoke and no fire. Consider the following:

1) There's been innuendo creating smoke for decades without a single fire.
2) All that despite multiple operatives who's sole job was to find something on them
3) Hacked access to teens of thousands of emails, yet nothing showed anything of importance
4) FBI had access to teens of thousands more emails, yet nothing
5) Clinton Foundation financials are fairly open, yet no one has found anything


At some point, if there was something there they'd have been caught, no?

[zarrell]

Are all you liberals / Democrats still sour about this? Time to move on and live your lives.

[Muta]

I feel that Trump was perceived as "anti-establishment, devoid of political toxic" enough that conservative voters thought that would be the injection that the WH sorely needed. Hilary was seen as another political stooge, especially as a Clinton.

As bad as Clinton was, she was very, very good on the international stage and she definitely wouldn't have been the embarrassment that Trump has become.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by zarrell

Are all you liberals / Democrats still sour about this? Time to move on and live your lives.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by zarrell

Are all you liberals / Democrats still sour about this? Time to move on and live your lives.

If you seriously want to have this conversation again please start a separate thread.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

I've heard many times from many people that Hillary was corrupt and flawed, and it was her own fault she did not win the election.

I'd like anyone to explain ...

1. What should she have done/done differently, to win the election?

2. How was/is she flawed/corrupt.

Feel free to include links to your sources, ie, Fox news, Breitbart, Infowars, World News Daily etc.

I don't believe she was corrupt, but I do believe some of her connections to corporate America made her susceptible to being labeled as a hypocrite or having conflicting interests. It essentially took away her biggest weapon to attack trump with on the campaign.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by zarrell

Are all you liberals / Democrats still sour about this? Time to move on and live your lives.

Like how conservatives and Republicans moved on once Obama was president?

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

It's not inconceivable to get back to the 50's level of growth. It's not just about workers making more money, back in those days business tax rates were significantly higher and companies weren't outsourcing work at anywhere near the rates they are today. These concepts aren't about stopping businesses from making money or making a lot of money, they're about maintaining overall domestic economic growth.

making a lot of money wasn't my point.

My point was, back in the 50's, the auto industry was the biggest employer, and people that were doing jobs that have long been replaced by automation, were making middle or above class wages.

Now, Walmart is the biggest employer in America and people are making minimum wages on part time hours.

Trump aint going to change that by bringing back coal jobs, building a pipeline, and ruining the environment, for sake of the fossil fuel industry making more money.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Reaper

Like how conservatives and Republicans moved on once Obama was president?

Woah man, it's not like they were asking for anything crazy like his tax returns, they just wanted to see his birth certificate and make sure he didn't destroy the country by giving people basic necessities like universal health care.