Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community - View Single Post - TD bank employees admit to breaking the law for fear of being fired

curves2000 · 03-11-2017, 03:08 AM

**** Heads up this is a long, passionate post so feel free to skip along but some good info here***

Former bank employee here myself and I can confirm with 100% confidence that this does happen across all different banks across the country for a variety of reasons, one of which is an ongoing issue with the insurance industry/lobby and the banking industry and how the federal government "regulates" banks via the Bank Act.

A few things to note though from the article and personal experiences some people may have had.

1) If a client requests a lending product such as a line of credit, credit card, auto loan than the client of course does need to do a credit check and application. If a client has a strong credit history, strong income, higher level of assets and an excellent long term relationship with the bank, than there is a strong possibility they may be approved for a higher lending amount than they thought or "need". Getting approved for a $20k line of credit when you only "need" $10k isn't illegal. The clients current financial situation suggest they could financially support a higher balance. It is illegal though to increase a client's borrowing limit on a product such as a credit card or line of credit without a client's authorization. This new rule came into effect a few years ago due to the fact that a lot of people were going deeper and deeper into debt without even realizing it. Some people would spend to their limit, pay a chunk off and than go back up to the now increased limit with even worse consequences. Rules have changed but as with anything rules are broken of course.

2) Earlier in my post when I mentioned an ongoing fued with the banks and the insurance companies boils down to this.
A) Banks are prohibited from selling BANK OWNED insurance products within their own branch network for things such as life insurance, disability insurance, auto insurance etc. All of these insurance products purchased or signed up for at the branch level are usually underwritten by a major Canadian insurance provider such as ManuLife, SunLife, London Life etc for products such as mortgage insurance. You will notice that banks such as RBC have branches and RBC Insurance offices usually next to each other, this is a way they can technically get away with selling their own proprietary insurance products "close by" to clients but not directly.

The issue that the banks have is that insurance products can usually be a fairly profitable business and they would LOVE the ability to sell their own products to their own existing clients via the branch/online network but they are prohibited by federal law. This is also why you see many banks offering insurance products only by calling a 1-800 line.

Insurance companies on the other hand are able to offer banking, credit and investment products alongside their own insurance offerings which technically gives them an edge but they traditionally haven't had expansive branch networks. Insurance companies have a whole host of products and services and what ends up happening is that US as consumers usually do, end up getting the short end of the stick when it comes to products, services and prices. If anybody wants me to go into further detail about insurance products and banks, I can. Do yourself a favor though and get REAL insurance for the major lending products in your life such as your mortgage.

3) When it comes to getting lending products approved ONLY if a client signs up for other products, well that is 100% illegal and its called tied selling. If the clients financially situation warrants an approval than they are approved. Banks are able to discount lending products or offer additional products and services at preferred rates as part of a package to attract and retain additional business, that's just smart business in my opinion. Customer X only wants 1 product @5% while customer Y was approved and wants 5 additional items? Price the loan @4% as an example.

This is also where additional products may have been offered to you even though you didn't request them.

4) The sales pressure in today's environment at financial institutions is REAL and concerning because as a profession, a lot of traditional bankers and advisers are being squeezed out. I partially blame TD for some of this with their push over the last 20 years of "ohh come on in, no appointment needed, we have some Joe Blow with an arts background willing to offer investment advice to you at 9 pm on a Thursday"

There was a time not too long ago where people had their banker, their lawyer, their accountant, their tailor, their mechanic, their doctor and pharmacist and a whole host of other professionals who could provide MEANINGFUL advice on the complex matters in life and could be counted on. Everything these days is so transnational, dealing with a new face every single time and having to tell your story from the beginning. Has anyone been to a Dr. office recently? Can you explain how they are always an hour late of your scheduled appointment when they clearly spend 2 minutes with every patient while writing a prescription for another drug when a LOT of times some MEDICAL ADVICE would be better??

As for investment sales in the traditional banking environment, part of that problem is that the banks today are trying to have everybody be everything to everybody. An expert at lending, analyzing risk, structuring loans and offering debt consolidating advice while at the same time time trying to keep up to date with changes in the equity , bond markets and other factors that affect your investment and retirement portfolios.

For the majority of bank clients who deal with the branch level employee's, odd's are the employee you are working with, aren't being paid a commission. Most of them are on salary with the potential for a small bonus come the end of the year so there isn't a large financial component for selling other products and services outside of their sales targets.

I will finish this long post off with this. Although the financial industry as a whole does get a bad rap the vast majority of people who work in the field are honest, good people who do care about their clients interest. Times have changed and so has the industry and sometimes not for the better. The thing that makes banks and insurance companies hatted is the fact that they deal with the emotional component of MONEY.

Corporations across the board from energy, medical,legal, automotive, food, technology or whatever have some EVIL people working there that do some awful things. At the end of the day no matter what industry you are in, there are guilty people by the thousands but its a sad reality of today's world.

If anybody has additional questions I will do my best to answer as this post has gone on LONG enough. Sorry about that!

03-11-2017, 03:08 AM	#65
curves2000 Powerplay Quarterback Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Calgary, Canada Exp:	** Heads up this is a long, passionate post so feel free to skip along but some good info here* Former bank employee here myself and I can confirm with 100% confidence that this does happen across all different banks across the country for a variety of reasons, one of which is an ongoing issue with the insurance industry/lobby and the banking industry and how the federal government "regulates" banks via the Bank Act. A few things to note though from the article and personal experiences some people may have had. 1) If a client requests a lending product such as a line of credit, credit card, auto loan than the client of course does need to do a credit check and application. If a client has a strong credit history, strong income, higher level of assets and an excellent long term relationship with the bank, than there is a strong possibility they may be approved for a higher lending amount than they thought or "need". Getting approved for a $20k line of credit when you only "need" $10k isn't illegal. The clients current financial situation suggest they could financially support a higher balance. It is illegal though to increase a client's borrowing limit on a product such as a credit card or line of credit without a client's authorization. This new rule came into effect a few years ago due to the fact that a lot of people were going deeper and deeper into debt without even realizing it. Some people would spend to their limit, pay a chunk off and than go back up to the now increased limit with even worse consequences. Rules have changed but as with anything rules are broken of course. 2) Earlier in my post when I mentioned an ongoing fued with the banks and the insurance companies boils down to this. A) Banks are prohibited from selling BANK OWNED insurance products within their own branch network for things such as life insurance, disability insurance, auto insurance etc. All of these insurance products purchased or signed up for at the branch level are usually underwritten by a major Canadian insurance provider such as ManuLife, SunLife, London Life etc for products such as mortgage insurance. You will notice that banks such as RBC have branches and RBC Insurance offices usually next to each other, this is a way they can technically get away with selling their own proprietary insurance products "close by" to clients but not directly. The issue that the banks have is that insurance products can usually be a fairly profitable business and they would LOVE the ability to sell their own products to their own existing clients via the branch/online network but they are prohibited by federal law. This is also why you see many banks offering insurance products only by calling a 1-800 line. Insurance companies on the other hand are able to offer banking, credit and investment products alongside their own insurance offerings which technically gives them an edge but they traditionally haven't had expansive branch networks. Insurance companies have a whole host of products and services and what ends up happening is that US as consumers usually do, end up getting the short end of the stick when it comes to products, services and prices. If anybody wants me to go into further detail about insurance products and banks, I can. Do yourself a favor though and get REAL insurance for the major lending products in your life such as your mortgage. 3) When it comes to getting lending products approved ONLY if a client signs up for other products, well that is 100% illegal and its called tied selling. If the clients financially situation warrants an approval than they are approved. Banks are able to discount lending products or offer additional products and services at preferred rates as part of a package to attract and retain additional business, that's just smart business in my opinion. Customer X only wants 1 product @5% while customer Y was approved and wants 5 additional items? Price the loan @4% as an example. This is also where additional products may have been offered to you even though you didn't request them. 4) The sales pressure in today's environment at financial institutions is REAL and concerning because as a profession, a lot of traditional bankers and advisers are being squeezed out. I partially blame TD for some of this with their push over the last 20 years of "ohh come on in, no appointment needed, we have some Joe Blow with an arts background willing to offer investment advice to you at 9 pm on a Thursday" There was a time not too long ago where people had their banker, their lawyer, their accountant, their tailor, their mechanic, their doctor and pharmacist and a whole host of other professionals who could provide MEANINGFUL advice on the complex matters in life and could be counted on. Everything these days is so transnational, dealing with a new face every single time and having to tell your story from the beginning. Has anyone been to a Dr. office recently? Can you explain how they are always an hour late of your scheduled appointment when they clearly spend 2 minutes with every patient while writing a prescription for another drug when a LOT of times some MEDICAL ADVICE would be better?? As for investment sales in the traditional banking environment, part of that problem is that the banks today are trying to have everybody be everything to everybody. An expert at lending, analyzing risk, structuring loans and offering debt consolidating advice while at the same time time trying to keep up to date with changes in the equity , bond markets and other factors that affect your investment and retirement portfolios. For the majority of bank clients who deal with the branch level employee's, odd's are the employee you are working with, aren't being paid a commission. Most of them are on salary with the potential for a small bonus come the end of the year so there isn't a large financial component for selling other products and services outside of their sales targets. I will finish this long post off with this. Although the financial industry as a whole does get a bad rap the vast majority of people who work in the field are honest, good people who do care about their clients interest. Times have changed and so has the industry and sometimes not for the better. The thing that makes banks and insurance companies hatted is the fact that they deal with the emotional component of MONEY. Corporations across the board from energy, medical,legal, automotive, food, technology or whatever have some EVIL people working there that do some awful things. At the end of the day no matter what industry you are in, there are guilty people by the thousands but its a sad reality of today's world. If anybody has additional questions I will do my best to answer as this post has gone on LONG enough. Sorry about that!