Fired For Eating Pork

[Cowperson]

Originally posted by fotze@Aug 4 2004, 06:34 PM
Morales, who is Catholic, was warned about eating pizza with meat the Muslim faith considered "unclean.," Local 6 News reported. She was then fire for eating a bacon, lettuce and tomato sandwich, according to the report.

http://www.local6.com/money/3614199/detail.html
Well, that's one lawsuit she's going to win hands down.

Just a question for the panel: "Do you know the religion of your co-workers?"

Cowperson

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Sounds like every religious person I know (of all faiths) - "Oh, we respect all other religions - it's just that we're right and they've got it all wrong"

[octothorp]

Interesting article, the only problem is it's not religious descrimination--I don't believe there's anything specified in the catholic faith that says you must eat pork. The woman is not being fired because she's following her religion, nor is the policy of the company interferring with her ability to practice her religion. She's being fired for carrying out a custom (allowed but not required by her religion) which offends the religious beliefs of the majority of her coworkers.

That said, is it really against the Qur'ran allow others to eat pork, or to work in a workplace in which pork is eaten? If not, it's not really a religious belief, either--simply one custom against another custom. And I'm not sure about the legality around that. Companies limit the rights of their employees all the time, and as long as it doesn't interfere with the religion or health of their employees, it seems to be completely acceptable. The issue in this case will probably end up being whether the woman in question was properly informed of the policy.

On the other hand, maybe she just didn't realize that ham and bacon come from the same animal.

[kermitology]

Unless it stated in the work agreement she signed that she must obey the rules of faith of the coworkers then there is no valid reason for firing her. Simple as that, it doesn't matter if it p*sses off the other coworkers, she's within her rights to eat pork if she wants.

[Cowperson]

Originally posted by octothorp@Aug 4 2004, 07:50 PM
Interesting article, the only problem is it's not religious descrimination--I don't believe there's anything specified in the catholic faith that says you must eat pork. The woman is not being fired because she's following her religion, nor is the policy of the company interferring with her ability to practice her religion. She's being fired for carrying out a custom (allowed but not required by her religion) which offends the religious beliefs of the majority of her coworkers.

That said, is it really against the Qur'ran allow others to eat pork, or to work in a workplace in which pork is eaten? If not, it's not really a religious belief, either--simply one custom against another custom. And I'm not sure about the legality around that. Companies limit the rights of their employees all the time, and as long as it doesn't interfere with the religion or health of their employees, it seems to be completely acceptable. The issue in this case will probably end up being whether the woman in question was properly informed of the policy.

On the other hand, maybe she just didn't realize that ham and bacon come from the same animal.
The owner basically said: "I fired her because eating a ham sandwich is against my religious beliefs, not hers."

I doubt very much you can establish a company policy outlawing ham sandwiches on pain of firing.

I think the owner was sincere in his comments, basically a cultural misunderstanding, but he's in America now and he's going to learn the lesson that he can't act in the manner that he did.
Cowperson

[Reggie Dunlop]

I worked for a Mormon dude once who wouldn't allow a coffee maker in the office. I had to hoof it over to the Timmy Hortons a few doors down for my caffiene fix.

Maybe I should have sued him for mental distress.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally posted by fotze+Aug 4 2004, 01:19 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (fotze @ Aug 4 2004, 01:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Reggie Dunlop@Aug 4 2004, 02:12 PM
I worked for a Mormon dude once who wouldn't allow a coffee maker in the office. I had to hoof it over to the Timmy Hortons a few doors down for my caffiene fix.

Maybe I should have sued him for mental distress.
No you should thank him for not subjecting you to the swill known as office coffee. If TimmyHo's was 2 doors down I would be happy. [/b][/quote]
Haha.... point taken. ;)

[300spartans]

Tough one, she KNEW that eating pork wasn't allowed, if she had a problem she should have quit. If company workers consider pork to be unclean, then having eaten it, she is also labelled as unclean ie. they would not want to deal with her or come into contact.

This whole thing sounds outrageous at first but it makes sense to me, SWINE!

[calf]

Originally posted by kermitology@Aug 4 2004, 02:00 PM
Unless it stated in the work agreement she signed that she must obey the rules of faith of the coworkers then there is no valid reason for firing her. Simple as that, it doesn't matter if it p*sses off the other coworkers, she's within her rights to eat pork if she wants.

But can someone be contractually forced to follow someone else's religion in order to maintain employment? Something doesn't smell right there to me. If it's a condition of employment at first, it doesn't seem right but I can see it flying. If it's brought up afterwards, it has Human Rights violation written all over it

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Yeah, this one is a bit of a sticky wicket.
Can the guy fire her for not following a tennant of his religion?
What if his religion says women can't work? Would he get away with never hiring women? Probalby not.
What if he was jewish? Could he make all of his employees get circumcised? Probalby not. You gotta draw the line somewhere.
That being said. I'm sure if there were clear written policies about eating pork it woulndn't be a problem. but for him to simply say these are the rules, probably isn't binding.

[theikon]

Originally posted by octothorp@Aug 4 2004, 07:50 PM

That said, is it really against the Qur'ran allow others to eat pork, or to work in a workplace in which pork is eaten? If not, it's not really a religious belief, either--simply one custom against another custom. And I'm not sure about the legality around that. Companies limit the rights of their employees all the time, and as long as it doesn't interfere with the religion or health of their employees, it seems to be completely acceptable. The issue in this case will probably end up being whether the woman in question was properly informed of the policy.


[QUOTE]

Garbage. I'm Muslim and there is no problem with someone else eating pork. Islam is a religion of peace and tolerance - opposed to what all these fundamentalists portray. I would not be offended by someone else eating pork, and I believe the majority of Muslims probably feel the same way.

It says in Quran that "there is no compulsion in religion."
i.e. people who are born Muslim, still have the choice to practice or not. Completley up to them. Since this is the case, I hardly can imagine a Muslim imposing his beliefs on someone who is non-Muslim.

[theikon]

This may be related, and of intrest.

Media fall for the conservative Muslim stereotype
By TAREK FATAH
The Globe and Mail
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto.../BNStory/Front/ (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040723.wcomment0723/BNStory/Front/)?

[Crazy Flamer]

Wrongful dismissal, at least it would be in this province. An employee has to do something pretty detrimental to the company in order to warrant being fired. Makes you wonder why more companies just don't pay workers in lieu of notice and avoid messy lawsuits.

[The Familia]

That's a load of garbage. You can't tell someone what they can and can't eat. I don't care if it's your belief or not, you can't force soemone to do something they don't wanna do. If she wants to eat pork then she has every right to be able to eat it. You can't get fired from a job for something as ridiculous as that. Last I checked, I found that every person has the right to follow any religion they choose, and eat what they like without being fired. If this guy has a problem with "dirty pork eaters," then he might as well move out of the country. How can he communicate with customers and clients, who I'm suspecting a good majority of them probably had bacon and eggs for breakfast, if he considers them unclean? How do you run a successful business with a rule like that? You can sell somehting to a unclean person, but you can't work with one...Hmmmm am I missing somehting? Double standard perhaps? Maybe he should leave a sign on his door stating that "clean" people only are allowed to purchase his products. This kind of crap really makes me sick. I have never had a problem with any religious beliefs or customs of or not of my own, but when you impose them on someone else in this type of manner, that is wrong, plain and simple. I don't care what you think, you have no right to implement your beliefs on someone else in a manner in which affects them from living a fair and normal life.

[TheCommodoreAfro]

Tell you what. If I was stuck in a job that wasn't all that grand and I wanted a way out and somebody said "you can't eat pork, FroGuy", I would be in there with a giant sausage and bag of pork rinds the next day at my desk, knowing how ultimately unenforcable the policy was as it contravines so many rights.

Fire me - I'll see you in court for my generous severance.

Come to think of it, I might have tried the same thing with the Mormon coffee guy.

[AaronSJ]

Originally posted by The Familia@Aug 5 2004, 12:19 AM
That's a load of garbage. You can't tell someone what they can and can't eat. I don't care if it's your belief or not, you can't force soemone to do something they don't wanna do. If she wants to eat pork then she has every right to be able to eat it. You can't get fired from a job for something as ridiculous as that.
That's not entirely true. In Canada (the US is similar), an employer has the right to dictate the rules of the workplace, as long as they don't infringe on the rights provided in the Human Rights Act, Canada Labour Code, or any provincial employment standards.

For example, an employer can prohibit employees from eating altogether (breaks excluded, obviously), or from eating certain products. You would likely be fired on the spot if you dared to eat a competitor's product in the workplace of a consumer packaged goods company such as Kraft, Hostess-Frito Lay, Nestle, etc.

The key difference in this case is that the "no pig" rule isn't formal and was applied unilaterally to one employee, based on religious reasons (which is a protected right). Actually, the real key to this case will likely be the fact that Muslim is forcing their beliefs onto a Christian in the USA, and that's just not going to sit well.