Mlb Deadline Day

[JiriHrdina]

From TSN.ca:

ESPN reports Boston Red Sox shortstop Nomar Garciaparra has been traded to the Chicago Cubs as part of a four team deal. Also, the New York Yankees have reportedly acquired Esteban Loaiza from the Chicago White Sox for Jose Contreras. Details to follow.
Also TSN is reporting that Randy Johnson will NOT be traded and that Larry Walker vetoed a trade to the Rangers. Carlos Delgado has also said again that he will not waive his no-trade clause.

I also felt that the deal made by the Dodgers yesterday was brutal. They gave up their heart and soul in Paul Lo Duca along with the best set up man in the business in Guillermo Mota, and simply did not get enough back. Brutal trade.

[wookster]

IF nomar got traded, what SS did the red sox get back I wonder??

[Andrew]

cabrera for nomar isn't fair... i am sure tehy got more than that.

[JiriHrdina]

Updated from TSN.ca

The Red Sox have traded Nomar Garciaparra to the Chicago Cubs in a three-team shortstop swap. The Expos sent Orlando Cabrera to Boston and the Cubs sent Alex Gonzalez to the Expos. Also, the Yankees have reportedly acquired Esteban Loaiza from the White Sox for Jose Contreras. Details to follow.


My thoughts. Boston needed to trade Nomar. He clearly hasn't been happy there since they tried to replace him with A-Rod, and it was becoming a distraction. They get a better defensive SS in Cabreera. Cubs get a good bat for their lineup at a very small cost. The 'spos of course get the shaft, only getting Alex Gonzalez.

So good deal for Cubbies and Bosox. Bad for the 'spos.

[Andrew]

edit: I think it is wrong

[wookster]

I think they should have gotten more for Nomar as well. Also reading that Steve Finley has gone to LA - espn.com

oh wait, the finley thing is still in the works.

[JiriHrdina]

Well TSN has changed their site again. Now it doesn't have any details and says that four teams are involved in the deal.

ESPN is reporting that the Bosox also got Doug Mientkiewcz.

Edit: If this last part is true I guess that means the Twins are the fourth team. Not sure what they get though.

[Resolute 14]

To Boston: 1B Meinkiwiecz and SS Cabrera
To Cubs: SS Nomar, OF Murton
To Montreal: SS Gonzalez
To Twins: P Justin Jones

Wow did the Sox ever get screwed.

The Cubs just raped them.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally posted by Snakeeye@Jul 31 2004, 03:39 PM
To Boston: 1B Meinkiwiecz and SS Cabrera
To Cubs: SS Nomar, OF Murton
To Montreal: SS Gonzalez
To Twins: P Justin Jones

Wow did the Sox ever get screwed.

The Cubs just raped them.
I disagree.

Boston gets way better defensively at first and SS with the deal and unload an unhappy player in Nomar. Its not like the Bosox needed his bat - they have plenty of hitting.

Cubs also look very good in this deal adding a big bat.

I don't know enough about Justin Jones to evaluate how the Twinkies did.

Expos look the worst in this.

[Flickered Flame]

Good moves by the BoSox today. They also got another OFer by getting Dave Roberts from the dodgers for a minor leaguer. The expos did ok I thought. Gonzalez is a decent ss, and the pitcher they got should be ok.

The Twins didn't really need another MLB player in return, they have Morneau up now to play first base.

I'm shocked at all the moves the dodgers are making...especially considering they are in first place.

[Resolute 14]

Originally posted by JiriHrdina@Jul 31 2004, 09:51 PM
I disagree.

Boston gets way better defensively at first and SS with the deal and unload an unhappy player in Nomar. Its not like the Bosox needed his bat - they have plenty of hitting.

Cubs also look very good in this deal adding a big bat.

I don't know enough about Justin Jones to evaluate how the Twinkies did.

Expos look the worst in this.
Good thing they have plenty of hitting, because they didnt get any in this trade.

"Way better at first" is really meaningless, as 1B is the least challenging position to play, and whatever improvement they get with Meinkiwiecz will amount to no more than a few runs over the rest of the season.

Cabrera is definitely a defensive improvement on Nomar, but the offensive difference dwarfs the defensive benifit.

The Red Sox are a worse team now than they were one day ago.

[JiriHrdina]

Are you a RedSox fan Snakeye (just curious).

I'm not but I think the bigger dissapointment for Sox fans would not be that Nomar is gone but rather that they didn't get any pitching back. With Derek Lowe looking very erratic right now I think they needed another arm. Nomar would have been excellent trade bait to get that arm but instead they got two positional players. I think the trade isn't bad, but didn't address their real need.

[the_only_turek_fan]

I dont know much about bball, but isnt Nomar really good?

Good new for the Cubs, my uncle in Chicago loves them.....

[Resolute 14]

Turek - since the Yankees chose to move Arod to third in favour of the massively inferior Derek Jeter, some have argued that Nomar is now the best shortstop in the game.

Jiri - No, I'm a Jays fan, but I just cannot see any benifit to this deal for Boston.

They seriously downgraded themselves overall at short, and Meintkiewicz doesnt add much at all. Even with the addition of Roberts, I just dont see how the Red Sox have positioned themselves to pass either Texas or Oakland for the Wild Card.

I dont think they did anything to help themselves for the present, and since I believe that both Meintkiewicz and Cabrera are free agents after this season, they didnt do anything for the future.

[snowdude]

Hmmm maybe this will mean we can get a cubs red sox world series..... :huh: :D Ok i guess the flames have a better chance of.......hey :)

[Fuzzy McGillicuddy]

I agree the Red Sox get better defensively by trading Nomar, but that doesn't mean I have to like the trade.

Nomar is one of the classiest guys in sport. He's a refreshing change in a day over overpaid, spoiled and petulant athletes.

My favorite Garciaparra story was during a game a few years ago. The hitter at the play sends an infield popup into foul territory along the third base side. The Red Sox third baseman and Garciaparra both attempt to chase down the ball, but it starts fading into the seats. As everyone else is looking up at the ball, Garciaparra is standing alongside the seats nibbling on a couple of pieces of popcorn from some kids tub. The kid looks back down to see Nomar eating his popcorn. The two share a quick laugh and the game is back on. What do you think that kid will remember for the rest of his life?

Nomar was a fan favorite, one of the most popular Red Sox players ever. But the Red Sox were under the gun to make a move. The defense has been brutal. The team is hitting and has been getting pretty good pitching. It's likely Nomar would have been gone at the end of the year anyway.

[transplant99]

Boston HAD to make that deal...they were absolutely brutal defensively and that all changed in one trade.

Also Snakeeye, even tho the players coming in are UFA after this season...so is Nomar.

Here is the take from a Boston writer...

The blockbuster trade was driven by a number of factors, most notably the great likelihood the Sox would lose Garciaparra to free agency after the season (he harbored deep resentment over the way the Sox tried to replace him last winter with Alex Rodriguez) and Epstein's belief that the Sox defense potentially harbored a "fatal flaw." The Sox entered the night leading the majors in unearned runs allowed (74).

The Sox also decided to move Garciaparra after he informed the medical staff within the last three days that he would need considerable time (more than just random days off but not a trip to the disabled list) the remainder of the season to rest his injured right Achilles' tendon. The Sox disclosed the information to the Cubs before they completed the deal. Garciaparra missed the first 57 games of the season with Achilles' tendinitis.

They are a better team today than they were yesterday. That makes me happy only because I cheer for anyone and everyone to beat the Yankees.

Knowing they were going to lose Nomar for nothing at the end of the season...this is an even better deal.

Story (http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2004/08/01/sox_trade_nomar_to_cubs_at_deadline/)

[Fuzzy McGillicuddy]

Dan Shaughnessy with the Boston Globe reveals a side of Nomah that most Red Sox fans were likely unaware of.

Nomar the selfish (http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2004/08/01/in_short_it_was_time_for_him_to_go/)

[transplant99]

He can say whatever he wants in front of the camera and he can flash that insincere smile, but make no mistake: He hates Boston and he hates the Red Sox and you should be glad that he's gone. If you are a Red Sox fan, he is not your friend.

Doesn't it make you wonder why this article wasn't penned until the day AFTER he is no longer on the team?

Pretty bush league by Shaughnessy IMO...but I do agree with one line in this story.....

The Red Sox traded a great player. But they have a chance to be a better team without him.

Same thing that happened to the Rangers after ridding themselves of A-Rod.

[sbailey924]

I was hoping that Nomar would have ended up in LA. I really like the guy, but now he's with the Cubs, I'm going to have to root against him. The Cubs are, to me, the most self-righteous sports franchise (fans mostly).

[Sylvancrunch]

What did the Dodgers end up getting for LoDuca? I know they were after Charles Johnson as a replacement but the deal fell through. Still seems strange that the Dodgers in first place would give up a guy like LoDuca. Even stranger the Padres did nothing to try and jump on the Dodgers. I guess nobody wants to win that division.

[RedHot25]

Originally posted by Sylvancrunch@Aug 3 2004, 09:02 PM
What did the Dodgers end up getting for LoDuca? I know they were after Charles Johnson as a replacement but the deal fell through. Still seems strange that the Dodgers in first place would give up a guy like LoDuca. Even stranger the Padres did nothing to try and jump on the Dodgers. I guess nobody wants to win that division.
I think that they got Brent Mayne in a deal for a catcher.

Ouch is all I have to say to that one.

[RedHot25]

Actually, this is whose catching the game tonight (Aug 3/04)

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/6956

Dave Ross

Last 3 years Team G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB CS AVG OBP SLG OPS
2002 LOS 8 10 2 2 1 0 1 2 2 4 0 0 .200 .385 .600 .985
2003 LOS 40 124 19 32 7 0 10 18 13 42 0 0 .258 .336 .556 .892
2004 LOS 34 89 5 15 1 1 3 9 9 32 0 0 .169 .252 .303 .556
Career 82 223 26 49 9 1 14 29 24 78 0 0 .220 .305 .457 .762

Stats look pretty crappy until you look at his OBP - then you can see DePodesta and the Sabametrics coming through.

And yup, I was right - its Mayne and Ross as LA's catchers.