A Game of Thrones

[SoulOfTheFlame]

Since A Song of Ice and Fire seems to be on indefinite hold... We have something else to look forward to: The HBO series!!!!

Cast is now out: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0944947/


Sean Bean and Peter Dinkladge? The cast is freaking sick. This show is going to be great.

[GreenLantern]

Finally! George R.R. Martin sold these rights a few years ago and it looks like we will actually get to see it move into something concrete.

[Kybosh]

What's the deal with the books though?

Fortunately, someone else on CP posted something about Steven Erikson and since reading his first book I've been completely enthralled. I think I'm 5 books into the series now and I've almost forgotten entirely about how lame wheel of time got (and Robert Jordan's death) and the huge stall with George R.R. Martin.

[Agamemnon]

I cannot wait for this to come out... thank God it's HBO doing it.

[troutman]

What's the deal with the books though?

Fortunately, someone else on CP posted something about Steven Erikson and since reading his first book I've been completely enthralled. I think I'm 5 books into the series now and I've almost forgotten entirely about how lame wheel of time got (and Robert Jordan's death) and the huge stall with George R.R. Martin.

Just finished Book 8 - Toll The Hounds. This series towers above all the rest. I think someone has the movie rights to do Book 2 (The Deadhouse Gates). Some are intimidated by the complexity and number of characters, but I have never found this to be a problem. Jordan is children's lit by comparison.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malazan_Book_of_the_Fallen

Rumors of a film version of the series have circulated for the past several years. Steven Erikson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson) and Ian Cameron Esslemont (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Cameron_Esslemont) originally developed Gardens of the Moon as a film script, apparently a comedy centering on the Phoenix Inn Regulars of the first novel. All copies of this script now seem to have been lost. More recently, a script has been in development entitled Chain of Dogs, which is essentially an adaptation of a major plot strand of the novel Deadhouse Gates. This script is awaiting funding. The writers (who have consulted with Steven Erikson on the project) have declared they hope to fund the film outside of the Hollywood (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood) system, but acknowledge the large budget and extensive CGI requirements may make this impossible.

Discussions have been entered into about a role-playing game based on the series, possibly using the D20 system (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D20_system) used by the newest version of Dungeons & Dragons (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dungeons_%26_Dragons).[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)] No formal announcement has yet been made.

There is a board game based on Game of Thrones that is something like Diplomacy.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/6472

http://images.boardgamegeek.com/images/pic31686_t.jpg (http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/31686)

[GreenLantern]

Wheel of Time is terrible... they have now changed the last book into three books and the plot summary for the next book is horribly slow paced, just like the series.

Steven Erikson..? I haven't heard of this guy.. checking it out right now.

[Kybosh]

Wheel of Time is terrible... they have now changed the last book into three books and the plot summary for the next book is horribly slow paced, just like the series.

Steven Erikson..? I haven't heard of this guy.. checking it out right now.

I personally found the first book of the Malazan series sort of meh and didn't read the second book for a long time afterward. When I finally got to the second book I was hooked. Where I'm at in the series, there are so many well developed characters that I can't put the damn books down (despite each one being 1000+ pages). This won't ruin anything, but the whole ascendancy thing is so mysterious and interesting.

[GreenLantern]

I am kind of on a break from fantasy novels right now.. I read WOT 1-11 straight starting with the prelude.. and I thought wow nothing can top this! Prior to that I was reading The Black Company (Which is good, but can't compete with this level). Then I read that new J.R.R Tolkien book.. the one about the twins I can't remember the tittle.

Then I thought well I am screwed till book 12 because I won't find another series as good as WOT.. until a buddy finally convinced me to pick up Martin's Song of Fire and Ice. And wow, oh wow.. was I blown away. Just on a complete new level so when I finished book four I thought well now I am screwed again.. but I will take a chance on Erickson who is also Canadian it seems.

[Bobblehead]

I like Erikson (haven't read the newest one yet). Vey complex; lots of characters.

I also really like Guy Gavriel Kay. I recently re-read "Lions of Al-Rassan" and it is a very good book too and apparently also in development (at least it has a page at IMDB). I like a lot of his stuff but his latest Ysabel I didn't enjoy as much.

And what is it about Winnipeg? Erikson was born in Toronto but raised in Winnipeg, Kay was born in Weyburn and raised in Winnipeg.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Gavriel_Kay

[Aeneas]

I like Erikson (haven't read the newest one yet). Vey complex; lots of characters.

I also really like Guy Gavriel Gay. I recently re-read "Lions of Al-Rassan" and it is a very good book too and apparently also in development (at least it has a page at IMDB). I like a lot of his stuff but his latest Ysabel I didn't enjoy as much.

And what is it about Winnipeg? Erikson was born in Toronto but raised in Winnipeg, Kay was born in Weyburn and raised in Winnipeg.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Gavriel_Kay

Kay not Gay there Freud.
I also really enjoyed everything by Kay except Ysabel also. Kind of wrote it for his sons I think.

[Aeneas]

[quote=troutman;2074561]Just finished Book 8 - Toll The Hounds. This series towers above all the rest. I think someone has the movie rights to do Book 2 (The Deadhouse Gates). Some are intimidated by the complexity and number of characters, but I have never found this to be a problem. Jordan is children's lit by comparison.
I have found Jordan to have really bogged down to almost unreadable levels. However, you are criticising something you said you have never read. Curious.

[Resolute 14]

What's the deal with the books though?

Fortunately, someone else on CP posted something about Steven Erikson and since reading his first book I've been completely enthralled. I think I'm 5 books into the series now and I've almost forgotten entirely about how lame wheel of time got (and Robert Jordan's death) and the huge stall with George R.R. Martin.

A Dance with Dragons will hopefully be out soon... Martin is going to have to get these last three books done sooner rather than later, or the TV series is going to end with a cliffhanger that never gets resolved!

Erikson (and Esselmont) have created a pretty damned impressive world. Toll the Hounds really bogged down for me though. I hope Dust of Dreams is more like the middle books of the series than the last in its style and pace.

[troutman]

[quote=troutman;2074561]Just finished Book 8 - Toll The Hounds. This series towers above all the rest. I think someone has the movie rights to do Book 2 (The Deadhouse Gates). Some are intimidated by the complexity and number of characters, but I have never found this to be a problem. Jordan is children's lit by comparison.
I have found Jordan to have really bogged down to almost unreadable levels. However, you are criticising something you said you have never read. Curious.

I've looked at Jordan, but it always seemed a bit cliche for my liking:

http://www.sfsite.com/11a/kd211.htm

Granted, the usual juvenile role-playing now expected of Jordan continues, testing the credulity of a more adult audience. Recalling some of the Hollywood gender stereotypes of the 30s and 40s, we have plenty of braid-tugging, sniffing, foot-stamping and hands-on-hips from the part of the tale's heroines; Elayne blaming Rand for the unpleasant aspects of her pregnancy; and a lot of looks that could kill. Aes Sedai are spanked for misbehavior. Meanwhile the males of this saga remain utterly baffled by their feminine counterparts, resigned to a philosophy of can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em. This kind of clichéd battle between the sexes, long ago overdone in film by the likes of Flynn and Gable, is certain to put off more mature or sophisticated readers, especially as Jordan obviously delights in revisiting it. Yet high fantasy has always indulged romance in one form or another, and the continued popularity of romantic fiction and these types of worn-out archetypes may suggest that Jordan has tapped into role models that retain relevance for a significant portion of his readers, or that the series has always been aimed at a young-adult audience. It could also be argued, I suppose, that progress has been made over Tolkien in providing strong, equal roles, however stereotyped or anachronistic. But this series is unlikely to find adherents among the readers of more serious or literary-minded fantasy.

I think China Mieville is also a superb fantasy writer, especially Perdido Street Station and The Scar.

http://www.sfsite.com/07b/ps108.htm

http://www.sfsite.com/04a/ts149.htm

[Aeneas]

I didn't know Elayne was pregnant, thanks alot.

[Bobblehead]

I didn't know Elayne was pregnant, thanks alot.

ya gotta hate when someone spoils something from a book that was published 6.5+ years ago.

[Aeneas]

ya gotta hate when someone spoils something from a book that was published 6.5+ years ago.
You got me there.

Hey I read the first 4 when they came out and they were excellent. Then 5 and 6 kind of dragged and 7 got no better. I gave up then. However, hearing the at the series would come to a conclusion I made the effort to read 5-11. I have made it to ten, but it's a struggle. Many of the things sfsite brought up in there review are spot on.

Same as Goodkind, after 4-5 giant books...ugh.

That's why I am holding off starting Erickson. Is this series going to end?

[troutman]

That's why I am holding off starting Erickson. Is this series going to end?

We hope not.

The current series is capped at 10 books. Esslemont is also writing five novels in this world.

During a 2008 question and answer session in Seattle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle), Washington (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington), Erikson stated he had signed a deal to write two more trilogies and six novellas;[15] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson#cite_note-YouTube7-14) Erikson planned to use the novellas to continue the Bauchelain and Korbal Broach storyline[16] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson#cite_note-15) while one of the trilogies would be a prequel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prequel) to the main series, detailing the history of Anomander Rake (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anomander_Rake) and Mother Dark.[15] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson#cite_note-YouTube7-14) During the same interview, Erikson stated that the upcoming book in the main series, Dust of Dreams (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dust_of_Dreams) (set to be released in the United Kingdom (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom) August 18th, 2009[17] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson#cite_note-16)) would be the first novel to end on a cliffhanger.[18] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson#cite_note-17)

An Encyclopedia is planned after the completion of the first 10 books.

[GreenLantern]

I do agree that the constant braid pulling and hands on hips stuff is annoying... there is a lot of great stuff in there too. Rand's constant battle with Lews Therin is simply astonishing writing.

I loved any part with Lan as well, he is such a great character. Matt, Perrin.. now that I think about it he does a great job of developing his male characters, but he really makes me dislike the female ones.. I can't think of one female character in that book I actually give a rats arse about besides Moiraine.

If you want to read a book simply to appreciate character development, I would say pick up books 1-6.. after that it gets a bit out there. When that old Cadsuane starts coming around I can barely stand to read any of Rand's parts..

But again, 1-6 are still among some of my favourite books and can stand toe to toe with most anything I have read.

[Ashartus]

You got me there.

That's why I am holding off starting Erickson. Is this series going to end?

The current Erikson series (Malazan Book of the Fallen) only has 1 more book to go, so yes. There will be other books set in the same world though.

I'm really wondering what will happen to the Game of Thrones TV series if Martin doesn't pick up the pace with his writing - presuming they do 1 season per book they'll catch up to him eventually. I guess with HBO they might increase the amount of time between seasons, but sooner or later they'd need to move things forward.

[troutman]

http://www.georgerrmartin.com/news.html

[HPLovecraft]

Erikkson's series is pretty brilliant, although I don't really like the "magic" system that he's created. His lack of clunky fantasy exposition makes his books worth their weight in gold, though, compared to others in the genre.

I still can't believe Sam Raimi is making a TV series out of Terry Goodkind's abortion that is his writing.

[CaramonLS]

I think China Mieville is also a superb fantasy writer, especially Perdido Street Station and The Scar.

Second this. Was it you who recommended this to me trout?

[CaramonLS]

Just finished Book 8 - Toll The Hounds. This series towers above all the rest. I think someone has the movie rights to do Book 2 (The Deadhouse Gates). Some are intimidated by the complexity and number of characters, but I have never found this to be a problem. Jordan is children's lit by comparison.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malazan_Book_of_the_Fallen

Rumors of a film version of the series have circulated for the past several years. Steven Erikson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Erikson) and Ian Cameron Esslemont (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Cameron_Esslemont) originally developed Gardens of the Moon as a film script, apparently a comedy centering on the Phoenix Inn Regulars of the first novel. All copies of this script now seem to have been lost. More recently, a script has been in development entitled Chain of Dogs, which is essentially an adaptation of a major plot strand of the novel Deadhouse Gates. This script is awaiting funding. The writers (who have consulted with Steven Erikson on the project) have declared they hope to fund the film outside of the Hollywood (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood) system, but acknowledge the large budget and extensive CGI requirements may make this impossible.


The Coltaine line in the series is absolutely epic, would be amazing if they made it into a movie.

[Mike F]

Bumping the thread with the first photos from the set courtesy of Entertainment Weekly (http://www.ew.com/ew/gallery/0,,20385926_20442931,00.html), including this one of Bran Stark & Jon Snow:

http://img2.timeinc.net/ew/dynamic/imgs/101117/Game-of-Thrones-arrow_360.jpg

[dissentowner]

Am I the only one who finds Erikson unreadable? I heard the hype and bought the first 4 books and had to force myself through them. The guy is all over the place and I just could not get into it at all. Like Martin's work so much better!

[dissentowner]

BTW I just finished Joe Abercombie's First Law Trilogy, absolutely excellent and a must read!

[V]

I've picked up and put down Erikson's first book three times. I just can't get through it. My cousin swears by the series, but I just can't get into it.

[CaramonLS]

2nd, 3rd and 4th books are amazing (Erikson) - the entire chain of dogs storyline with Coltaine was what completely hooked me on the series.

[ernie]

Like Erikson.

Martin better not die before he finishes the series like a certain other author.

[dissentowner]

Like Erikson.

Martin better not die before he finishes the series like a certain other author.

At the pace he is going it is an almost certainty he will never finish ASOFAI.
He is more dedicated to watching football and going to book conventions then finishing these books. Truly sad because I love the series.

[Ashartus]

At the pace he is going it is an almost certainty he will never finish ASOFAI.
He is more dedicated to watching football and going to book conventions then finishing these books. Truly sad because I love the series.

I'm hoping with the TV series he'll get a bit more external pressure to focus on finishing the series - otherwise the TV series will catch up to the books pretty fast if it's a success.

[Torture]

I've just started re-reading A Game of Thrones. I forgot how good that book is, gets you right from the start.

Now my only problem is that I could only find the first and fourth book..

[HPLovecraft]

Am I the only one who finds Erikson unreadable? I heard the hype and bought the first 4 books and had to force myself through them. The guy is all over the place and I just could not get into it at all. Like Martin's work so much better!

You finished the first 4 books and still say this? The first couple books in his series seem a bit random because he starts right in the middle of it all with very little exposition and it can get confusing, but I found it started to come together and make sense by Memories of Ice. He has very flowery prose compared to Martin, that's for certain, and his writing can get bogged down in it sometimes, but he paints a very vivid world. I suppose it's up to personal choice on which type of writing style they prefer from their fantasy authours.

[Top Shelf]

George RR Martin really pisses me off, it's been 5 years since Feast and once in a while he releases a chapter for Dragons. It has been 15 years since he started the series and he has 4 finished books to show for it?

Meanwhile Erikkson has 9 books and has pretty much been pumping them out 1 per year.

GRRM is going to die before he finishes, the dude just looks ancient. His writing in those first four books though is just awesome though, I am way overdue for a reread, except once I do I'll get pissed off all over again.

This TV show sounds promising though

[dissentowner]

George RR Martin really pisses me off, it's been 5 years since Feast and once in a while he releases a chapter for Dragons. It has been 15 years since he started the series and he has 4 finished books to show for it?

Meanwhile Erikkson has 9 books and has pretty much been pumping them out 1 per year.

GRRM is going to die before he finishes, the dude just looks ancient. His writing in those first four books though is just awesome though, I am way overdue for a reread, except once I do I'll get pissed off all over again.

This TV show sounds promising though

Even worse is that unlike Jordan, he has made no cliffnotes nor even knows how he will end the series which means when he eventually dies without finishing asofai we are all boned! :mad:

[Bob]

George RR Martin really pisses me off, it's been 5 years since Feast and once in a while he releases a chapter for Dragons. It has been 15 years since he started the series and he has 4 finished books to show for it?

Meanwhile Erikkson has 9 books and has pretty much been pumping them out 1 per year.

GRRM is going to die before he finishes, the dude just looks ancient. His writing in those first four books though is just awesome though, I am way overdue for a reread, except once I do I'll get pissed off all over again.

This TV show sounds promising though

++

I've essentially given up on the book series. Even if/when book 5 is released, it'll be years and years and years before anything else comes along, and people know it. His credibility is completely shot with a lot of fans.

For as much flack as Robert Jordan took, he at least continued to write more or less the entire time.

[GreenLantern]

I was under the impression that ASOFAI was to be 6 books long?

I don't remember where I heard that though.. any truth to it?

I had completely forgotten about this Steven Erikson until this thread got bumped, he is back on the list.

[SoulOfTheFlame]

Even worse is that unlike Jordan, he has made no cliffnotes nor even knows how he will end the series which means when he eventually dies without finishing asofai we are all boned! :mad:

He's a freewriter. It's probably why his books are so good, the stories take on a life of their own during the writing. Problem is he doesn't know the frame work of how to get the overall story to its conclusion.

At this point I'm just hoping he writes SOMETHING more in the SOIAF universe. There's some pretty awesome prequels he's done called "Dunc and Egg" in that universe and they are quite nice. Still, gotta hope he finds the way and finishes it.

[Phaneuf3]

I was under the impression that ASOFAI was to be 6 books long?

I don't remember where I heard that though.. any truth to it?

I had completely forgotten about this Steven Erikson until this thread got bumped, he is back on the list.
It was going to be 6 but as he wrote book 4 he found it was going to be WAYYYY too long and split it into 2 separate books (A Feast For Crows/A Dance With Dragons). Each book picks half of the cast of characters to follow over roughly the same time period.

So... was planned for 6 total. Now up to 7. Waiting on book 5 now.



Personally, I was pretty disappointed in A Feast For Crows. I didn't find it as interesting as the previous ones. For a frame of reference I picked up the first book not too long after A Feast For Crows was released. If more gets released in the next few years, I'll probably pick up the new one(s) just cause I've invested so much time in reading the series up to this point and not because I'm really looking forward to it anymore.

[Resolute 14]

The problem with FFC is that it is only half a book, and the other half (A Dance With Dragons) has all the better characters.

[Resolute 14]

43LW7a_NKMk

To say this looks like it will be awesome is something of an understatement.

[WhiteTiger]

I am so tempted to get cable just to watch this show. I loved the books (though the fourth is pretty weak) and this just looks awesome.

[GreenLantern]

Yup, goose bumps.

Can't fricken wait.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

I've picked up and put down Erikson's first book three times. I just can't get through it. My cousin swears by the series, but I just can't get into it.

Yeah I just read the first book and kept waiting and waiting for it to become good. Maybe George R. R. Martin has just raised my expectations of a fantasy novel to a level that cannot be matched by almost every writer.

Not sure I'll be continuing with the Erikson series. Didn't find any of the characters compelling. The author seemed to like to just introduce new magical entities without explaining them over and over again.

For the people who liked the Malazan books, was the first one just bad and then it gets better? Or is the first one representative of how the series will go.

[CaramonLS]

Yeah I just read the first book and kept waiting and waiting for it to become good. Maybe George R. R. Martin has just raised my expectations of a fantasy novel to a level that cannot be matched by almost every writer.

Not sure I'll be continuing with the Erikson series. Didn't find any of the characters compelling. The author seemed to like to just introduce new magical entities without explaining them over and over again.

For the people who liked the Malazan books, was the first one just bad and then it gets better? Or is the first one representative of how the series will go.

1st one = meh, it was decent
2nd, 3rd and 4th = off the charts for awesome.

[HPLovecraft]

Yeah I just read the first book and kept waiting and waiting for it to become good. Maybe George R. R. Martin has just raised my expectations of a fantasy novel to a level that cannot be matched by almost every writer.

Not sure I'll be continuing with the Erikson series. Didn't find any of the characters compelling. The author seemed to like to just introduce new magical entities without explaining them over and over again.

For the people who liked the Malazan books, was the first one just bad and then it gets better? Or is the first one representative of how the series will go.

1st one is definitely the weakest. The thing about Erikkson's books, he never explains ANYTHING through long-winded fantasy info dumps. You basically learn as you go through the plot, and it's one of the reasons the books get better as you go, since you become more familiar with the ideas and the world.

The 2nd book, Chain of Dogs, is awesome. Read that and you'll likely change your mind completely.

As for book 1, the whole Darujhistan city-setting seemed like a pretty trite fantasy setting and was kind of blah. But it gets much better, believe me.

That being said, however, Martin and Erikkson are very different authours. It is possible to like one but dislike the other, IMO, even if both produce quality fiction in their own ways.

[GreenLantern]

I gotta pick these books up.. since I invested 11 books into Wheel of Time before picking up Martin I decided to finish this damn series off, I haven't been able to bring myself to crack book 12 yet though.

I just know I am going to pull my hair out in frustration going back to Jordan after reading Martin..

Has anyone read book 12 yet..? Any opinions without hijacking the thread?

[CaramonLS]

Book 12 is pretty good. Follows the series nicely, but not completely outstanding or anything.

[ernie]

I gotta pick these books up.. since I invested 11 books into Wheel of Time before picking up Martin I decided to finish this damn series off, I haven't been able to bring myself to crack book 12 yet though.

I just know I am going to pull my hair out in frustration going back to Jordan after reading Martin..

Has anyone read book 12 yet..? Any opinions without hijacking the thread?

Book 12 is clearly more Sanderson and less Jordan and that isn't a good thing. Sanderson just isn't a good writer compared to Jordan and it seems very obvious what parts Jordan had more fleshed out and whcih parts were mostly if not all crafted by Sanderson. Everything is so one dimensional and clumsy with Sanderson (fairly minor spoiler as example of clumsy writing: there is fight scene with Gawyn against the Seachan assassins after Egwene. They can hide in shadows so Gawyn knocks out lamps to even things up(i.e. no shadows). It seems that on a re-read someone pointed out light coming from underneath the door so that is "fixed" by throwing in a line that a bdoy of Gawyn's friend just happened to fall precisely in that spot blocking out that light. If it wasn't an afterthought it was clumsy writing, and if it was it was still clumsy writing end spoiler)

I understand it's hard to pick up a series that is 10 books in and try to craft what the original author intended but Sanderson really just picked a couple of personality traits from each character and repeats them ad nauseum. In particular, he continues to butcher Mat who he clearly has no idea how to write.

That said, a lot of side plot stuff gets tied up and everything gets positioned fairly nicely for the the final battle(s). For that reason I give it a 2.5 or 3 out 5. I hope that Jordan fleshed out the final volume better than it seems he did this one.

[dissentowner]

That said, a lot of side plot stuff gets tied up and everything gets positioned fairly nicely for the the final battle(s). For that reason I give it a 2.5 or 3 out 5. I hope that Jordan fleshed out the final volume better than it seems he did this one.

At least we get an end to it, that is better then I fear we will get with Martin.:(

[simonsays]

Ernie that's really too bad, because after book 11 or so Mat is one of the only characters left who isn't just 1 or 2 character traits and not much more.

But regardless of how the Sanderson books go I don't think I'm delving back into that universe. When I first read through it I couldn't understand how Jordan could make his characters arc towards powerful and stupid so quickly after book 4 or 5. I mean these people (some of them) can effectively IM each other, and trust becomes a major issue?

Plus, Jordan cannot write women at all, and his bad guys make the Cylons look like they had a plan. I can't believe I used to eagerly await each new book.

[ernie]

Ernie that's really too bad, because after book 11 or so Mat is one of the only characters left who isn't just 1 or 2 character traits and not much more.

But regardless of how the Sanderson books go I don't think I'm delving back into that universe. When I first read through it I couldn't understand how Jordan could make his characters arc towards powerful and stupid so quickly after book 4 or 5. I mean these people (some of them) can effectively IM each other, and trust becomes a major issue?

Plus, Jordan cannot write women at all, and his bad guys make the Cylons look like they had a plan. I can't believe I used to eagerly await each new book.

There is just the repeating of two things all the time with Mat in this book. Every paragraph either has a "bloody ashes" or "hey she looks nice, but not for me I'm married" thrown in. I wish I was kidding but it really is alomst every single paragraph. I found it very annoying. I was rolling my eyes numerous times while reading the book because of some of the writing. If I roll my eyes more than a couple of times I tend to put the book down. I only stuck with this one because I want to see how it ends. Spoiler: Sadly, it really looks like everything is being brought down the everyone lives happily ever after pathway. Rand is basically all powerful with not even a circle of women being able to hold him. Nynaeve discovers another thing can be healed that no one thought could be healed. Mat can roll dice or simply spin in a circle to find his way because he is lucky. The Forsaken continue to be hopeless to the point where you really do wonder how they were so feared or even got to prominent positions under the Great Lord. Egwene is the smartest Amyrlin ever and can outsmart numerous Aes Sedai 300+ years her senior with political manouvers etc etc etc etc. I'm preparing myself for a very unsatisfactory ending. A series like this that has some dark moments needs important people to die. Hell they even do bring Moiraine fully back so that the one significant loss all series hasn't been lost (obvious that was going to happen but still). I'm shocked one of Perrin or Mat haven't died yet and you know if Mat does end up dying it will be because "his luck ran out". INstead it's always characters you have no attachment to.

[jeremywilhelm]

The Malazan books are terrible.

Unreadable.

[GreenLantern]

I can't even remember who Gawyn is it's been so long..

Had to google it.. man I am out of the loop on that series.

[Bobblehead]

I didn't ever realize "Towers of Midnight" had been released.

[Resolute 14]

For the people who liked the Malazan books, was the first one just bad and then it gets better? Or is the first one representative of how the series will go.

Once you get into Coltaine and the Chain of Dogs storyline, it gets a lot better. If that doesn't bring you around on the series, then chances are high you won't be enthralled by anything else in the set. The first book was very clearly a rookie effort.

[Kybosh]

It took me two attempts to get through Gardens of the Moon. I had to work a little bit to get into the Malazan stories but I'm now thoroughly hooked.

I gave up entirely on the Wheel of Time after book 10 or so. The quality of writing went severely downhill and I had enough tugging on braids from all the female characters. Really looking forward to the Game of Thrones show but I'm also irritated that the fourth book sucked and we've been waiting so long for the fifth.

[Chump]

It took me two attempts to get through Gardens of the Moon. I had to work a little bit to get into the Malazan stories but I'm now thoroughly hooked.

I gave up entirely on the Wheel of Time after book 10 or so. The quality of writing went severely downhill and I had enough tugging on braids from all the female characters. Really looking forward to the Game of Thrones show but I'm also irritated that the fourth book sucked and we've been waiting so long for the fifth.

You quit right before they started to get good again.

The Malazan books certainly get better after Gardens of the Moon but Martin's books are still better. And to keep on topic I think this show is going to be amazing.

[JayP]

12 minute, behind-the-scenes type preview:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EVKp5nYxyI

[WhiteTiger]

12 minute, behind-the-scenes type preview:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EVKp5nYxyI

That is some great stuff. I need to get HBO just to watch this.

[FlameOn]

Another awesome HBO series to look forward to. Can't wait till April

[Top Shelf]

12 minute, behind-the-scenes type preview:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EVKp5nYxyI

I think I was just convinced to do a reread

[HPLovecraft]

George R.R. Martin looks like a fantasy character himself.

[Mike F]

Official premiere date is set: April 17, 2011 (http://www.aintitcool.com/node/47976)

[Torture]

I think I was just convinced to do a reread

Way ahead of you, on the fourth book right now. :D Probably my favourite book series.

Out of thanks JayP, thanks for putting that link up.

Spoiler:
I laughed when George R.R. Martin called Ned Stark the center of the series. Maybe of the first book...

[FlamingLonghorn]

God you guys are such nerds...

[Two Fivenagame]

Sorry for the bump,

I began reading Game of Thrones a few weeks ago after having read this thread...verrrry good so far.

[Codes]

Excellent series, indeed.

Extremely excited for the television adaptation, as well as the next novel in the series. It's like 3 years behind schedule, unfortunately.

[Bane]

Excellent series, indeed.

Extremely excited for the television adaptation, as well as the next novel in the series. It's like 3 years behind schedule, unfortunately.

I saw Martin speak at a book signing in Calgary in 2005, just after A Feast For Crows was released, and he had the book (600 pages) half done already. Odds are good he'll kick the bucket long before he's done the series. Hopefully he beats the odds.

Likewise, I'm looking forward to the HBO series.

[Bob]

Bump.

Wouldn't ya know, the fat man actually finished another book. A Dance With Dragons is coming out in July (http://winter-is-coming.net/2011/03/a-dance-with-dragons-to-release-july-12th/).

Now I have to go back and re-read the series, or else pour over fan-made wikis just to refresh my memory.

[Meelapo]

I got the whole series (up till this point) for my Kindle so once I finish this Ludlum book I'm going balls deep into this series (A Song of Fire and Ice).

[GreenLantern]

This is great news.. I started reading the new Wheel of Time books.. not good.

[Meelapo]

This is great news.. I started reading the new Wheel of Time books.. not good.

Uh-oh...I got the first few Wheel of Time books too as well as the Sword of Truths books.

[GreenLantern]

Uh-oh...I got the first few Wheel of Time books too as well as the Sword of Truths books.


I just have to finish the series... 11 books in.. all this time and I am so close.

But it isn't easy... especially after reading Martin's work..

[bomber317]

Bump.

Wouldn't ya know, the fat man actually finished another book. A Dance With Dragons is coming out in July (http://winter-is-coming.net/2011/03/a-dance-with-dragons-to-release-july-12th/).

Now I have to go back and re-read the series, or else pour over fan-made wikis just to refresh my memory.

wow, I never thought the day would come especially with all the TV show stuff he had been talking about on his blog.

[troutman]

The other great fantasy series just published the final volume:

http://www.sfsite.com/grc/1103/cglg.jpg

[Meelapo]

The other great fantasy series just published the final volume:

http://www.sfsite.com/grc/1103/cglg.jpg

The author is also Canadian and, from what I've read, the series is really good. One of the few that have actually come to conclusion while the author is still alive.

[Ashartus]

I might actually hold off on reading A Dance with Dragons then start re-reading the whole series once he's actually getting close to finishing the last book, in case there are any more gaps that long between books. The Crippled God on the other hand will be near the top of my reading list.

[Meelapo]

I just have to finish the series... 11 books in.. all this time and I am so close.

But it isn't easy... especially after reading Martin's work..

So do you recommend starting the Wheel of Time books before jumping in to George's work? I don't really want to read a great series and get to the Wheel of Time and invest so much in the first few books (which I heard were great) and then it takes a nose dive in quality.

And here's the other series I was talking about:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sword_of_Truth

Also, there's another Canadian author named Guy Gavriel Kay that writes some great fantasy books though I believe the fantasy is more world fantasy rather than magic and dragons type of fantasy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Gavriel_Kay

[Resolute 14]

The other great fantasy series just published the final volume:

Well, Erickson's set anyway. Esselmont just released (or is about to release) the third book in his part of the series, no?

Also, lol @ typical Martin: "George R. R. Martin is not finished the book yet, but is close enough that the publisher has decided to announce the date."

And speaking of Canadian authors, R. Scott Bakker's Prince of Nothing trilogy is decent.

[Ashartus]

So do you recommend starting the Wheel of Time books before jumping in to George's work? I don't really want to read a great series and get to the Wheel of Time and invest so much in the first few books (which I heard were great) and then it takes a nose dive in quality.

And here's the other series I was talking about:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sword_of_Truth

Also, there's another Canadian author named Guy Gavriel Kay that writes some great fantasy books though I believe the fantasy is more world fantasy rather than magic and dragons type of fantasy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Gavriel_Kay

Wheel of Time is a bit more "traditional" than the others. It's a long read, and the pace really slows in the later books. It was popular when it first started, but really I think a lot of newer series have surpassed it.

Sword of Truth personally I wouldn't recommend. The first book is ok, if a bit cliche. In later books he tries to imitate Ayn Rand and use them as a platform for promoting Objectivist philosophy. I'd have no problem with that, despite thinking the philosophy is out to lunch, except he doesn't really do a good job of it. Think lots of multi-page speeches about the wonders of capitalism and self-interest. The author also seems to have an obsession with rape and torture.

Guy Gavriel Kay is one of my favourites. His first trilogy was more of a traditional fantasy; his later books are almost more "historical", set in fictional lands that are based closely on real-world historical cultures. They definitely aren't the typical epic fantasy style; in some ways they're more explorations of the cultures. While I really like him, his books aren't for everyone, but since they're mostly pretty stand-alone it's pretty easy to read one and decide whether you like it without committing to a long series (I suggest Tigana or the Lions of al-Rassan).

If you like Martin and Erikson, another Canadian author worth checking out is R. Scott Bakker.

[Knalus]

I'm quite enjoying the Mistborn trilogy by Brandon Sanderson. Pretty decent for a fantasy series.

[GreenLantern]

So do you recommend starting the Wheel of Time books before jumping in to George's work? I don't really want to read a great series and get to the Wheel of Time and invest so much in the first few books (which I heard were great) and then it takes a nose dive in quality.

And here's the other series I was talking about:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sword_of_Truth

Also, there's another Canadian author named Guy Gavriel Kay that writes some great fantasy books though I believe the fantasy is more world fantasy rather than magic and dragons type of fantasy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Gavriel_Kay

I do not reccomend the Wheel of Time series at all. Unless you have read everything else and are desperate.

I have a new policy with fantasy series, I do not start reading them until the last book is written.

There are currently a few I am waiting out.

[Knalus]

I have a new policy with fantasy series, I do not start reading them until the last book is written.

There are currently a few I am waiting out.

I completely concur.

[Bob]

Now Martin himself has confirmed (http://www.georgerrmartin.com/if-update.html) the July release date.

####### better be done ...

[Kybosh]

It took him longer to write than stupid novel than it took me to finish my entire PhD.

[Bobblehead]

This date is different. This date is real.

Barring tsunamis, general strikes, world wars, or asteroid strikes, you will have the novel in your hands on July 12. I hope you like it.

(For what it's worth, the book's a monster. Think A STORM OF SWORDS.)

The dragons are coming. Prepare to dance.

And hey... thanks for waiting.
―George R.R. Martin, March 3, 2011http://www.georgerrmartin.com/if-update.html

[WhiteTiger]

Hm, I ought to be done re-reading the Sword of Truth books just in time to pick up Dance. Nice...very nice.

[troutman]

Game of Thrones: TV Review
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/review/game-thrones-tv-review-174120

Barely a few minutes into HBO’s epic Game of Thrones series, it’s clear that the hype was right and the wait was worth it.

Based on the bestselling fantasy book series A Song of Ice and Fire by George R.R. Martin – often referred to as “the American Tolkien” – HBO is betting that fans of The Lord of the Rings will come to this for a sprawling, interwoven tale of feuding families, swords, sex, carnage, beasts, frayed loyalties, deception, intrigue and the pursuit of power.

As well they should. Game of Thrones has all the elements (many described above) that lure viewers to shows like The Sopranos, et al. That it’s a fantasy series shouldn’t scare anyone away, because – like Lord of the Rings – there’s a real allure to costume-dramas that pair dense mythology with all of the crowd-pleasing elements of war, honor, pride, lust, power and, yes, even humor. Thrones has all of those in spades and supports them with exceptional storytelling, strong writing, superb acting and some stunning visual effects.

[Kybosh]

Game of Thrones: TV Review
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/review/game-thrones-tv-review-174120


I'm finally ditching my crappy CRT TV for a better HD one specifically for this show (and I'm tired of my TV convincing my eyes that I'm losing my sight).

[Knalus]

So, is the TV series a Miniseries, or is it an actual planned series with 20+ episodes a season and 3+ seasons planned?

I'm cool with either, just curious if anyone knows about that. I'm assuming with the amount of material they could do a longer series if they wanted.

[Ashartus]

So, is the TV series a Miniseries, or is it an actual planned series with 20+ episodes a season and 3+ seasons planned?

I'm cool with either, just curious if anyone knows about that. I'm assuming with the amount of material they could do a longer series if they wanted.

I believe it's a planned series, but not necessarily 20+ episodes a season. I've heard 10 episodes for season 1; presumably if it does well there will be more seasons based on the other books in the series.

[troutman]

Will the Season 1 DVDS be out by Xmas?

[JayP]

Will the Season 1 DVDS be out by Xmas?

I don't know when DVD's are typically released, but the first season will be finished airing by the end of June. I would have to think that they'd release DVD's with-in 6 months of that.

[cznTiburon]

Season 1 is 10 episodes. I have heard the plan is to finish a game of thrones by the end of season 1 (alot of book for 1 season). the books get longer so they may continue to do 1 season a book (they would have to stop at a Dance though because GRRM wont finish another one anytime soon) or they could start splitting books up a bit. The biggest issues is A Dance with Dragons and a feast of crows go on the same timeline so they would almost have to be combined to make a show.

[WhiteTiger]

Well, after watching that 15 minute 'teaser'...I want the whole thing, dammit! Looks fantastic!

[Bane]

First 15 minutes of Episode 1 (NSFW due to violence/gore) :w00t:

V9MItNxK_yY

Effing awesome :w00t:

[Coys1882]

I started the book twice and couldn't get into it. The announcement of this series prompted me to give it another go. I'm glad I did and now I've got the majority of the characters sorted in my head, I'm rather enjoying it.

[FlamesAllTheWay]

I started the book twice and couldn't get into it. The announcement of this series prompted me to give it another go. I'm glad I did and now I've got the majority of the characters sorted in my head, I'm rather enjoying it.

I started it many years ago and have read it a few times now. Enjoyed it immensely, thought it was well written with a very unique writing style. You certainly have characters you followed more or rooted for but it seemed everyone, good or bad, was given equal realistic treatment. Liked that the usual fantasy elements like magic, dragons, etc, were present, but significantly scaled back to the point of not existing or being possible in many characters eyes.

Glad to hear the TV series is getting good reviews early on. I'm curious to see how well they're able to translate the book onto TV as it would seem, at first glance, a difficult thing to do given the way the books are structured.

And WOW... I was just in the middle of writing how I hope the series actually gets finished within the author's lifetime as the next book has been pending for years now. I stopped checking his website for updates on the book as the most recent one was January 1st, 2008 telling fans to slag off, the book will be done when it's done. I figured maybe I'd head over to his website before I posted and, low and behold, there's an update as of March 3rd saying the new book is coming out in July! Things are looking up indeed.

[WindomURL]

30 minute "Inside 'Game of Thrones'" special airs tonight at 10pm (right after Flames Oilers) and 2:25am on HBO Canada
I've seen it a few months ago.. well worth PVRing

[WhiteTiger]

And WOW... I was just in the middle of writing how I hope the series actually gets finished within the author's lifetime as the next book has been pending for years now. I stopped checking his website for updates on the book as the most recent one was January 1st, 2008 telling fans to slag off, the book will be done when it's done. I figured maybe I'd head over to his website before I posted and, low and behold, there's an update as of March 3rd saying the new book is coming out in July! Things are looking up indeed.

That's actually a concern of a lot of the fan base. GRRM's getting up there in age, and his books are taking around 5 years each now. The one he just released was the second HALF of book 4, which he supposedly had done years ago. He originally claimed the series would run six books...he just fully finished #4, and the first was put out in August of 1996. So...for him to finish the last two books at his current rate (1/2 a book every 5 years) it'll be 2031 before he's done.

[Codes]

This is excellent news! I'm so excited for the next novel. Thanks for sharing!

[jeremywilhelm]

Wow, watched the preview, instant bro-ner.

[FlamesAllTheWay]

That's actually a concern of a lot of the fan base. GRRM's getting up there in age, and his books are taking around 5 years each now. The one he just released was the second HALF of book 4, which he supposedly had done years ago. He originally claimed the series would run six books...he just fully finished #4, and the first was put out in August of 1996. So...for him to finish the last two books at his current rate (1/2 a book every 5 years) it'll be 2031 before he's done.

Methinks he may need to write in a previously unplanned death of a prominent character or two if he wants to continue to develop each characters story arc in the depth and detail he has to this point. If he hasn't already in this next book. That or put off a lot of his side projects, because he's definitely running out of time at his current pace haha.

Book #4 has already ballooned into 2 seperate, lengthy books due to the amount of time he needs to dedicate to each character. He likes to introduce new ones as well so if he keeps his current pace I would expect more of what we've seen with #4 having to be split into two. I'm glad he's not sacrificing quality for the sake of pumping out all of the books in time though.

Anyways, I think I need to call Shaw and resubscribe to HBO for the sole purpose of watching the new series.

[Aeneas]

I am lazy, what will it cost to pick up HBO? A couple bucks a month extra? Or do I have to buy a package of other channels I will never watch?

[troutman]

I am lazy, what will it cost to pick up HBO? A couple bucks a month extra? Or do I have to buy a package of other channels I will never watch?

I looked into it, but with Shaw you have to buy HBO in a bundle with two other channels (that did not interest me).

Four uncut, commercial-free channels, including HBO Canada, plus get Movie Central HD and HBO Canada HD. And with your subscription get Movie Central on Demand complimentary.

$17 per month

[VANFLAMESFAN]

I am lazy, what will it cost to pick up HBO? A couple bucks a month extra? Or do I have to buy a package of other channels I will never watch?

If you're with Shaw, you order HBO in a package that includes Movie Central(3 standard def, 1 HD). The package is 17 bucks per month. Movie Central is not great and if it weren't for all the TV shows that I'm hooked on thru HBO and Movie Central, no chance would I pay that much.

If you're in desparate need to watch the show, I would say order the channels, but if money is tight or you can wait till the dvd's come out, I would recommend that.

[Ashartus]

I am lazy, what will it cost to pick up HBO? A couple bucks a month extra? Or do I have to buy a package of other channels I will never watch?

Shaw charges $17/month for HBO and the 2 movie channels (only available as a package). However, they gave me a 3 month trial, which should be enough time to get through the first season and cancel.

[Aeneas]

Excellent, thanks all. I may try the trial option. I can also wait for the DVD's, as long as troutman doesn't keep phoning me to say how excellent it is.

$17 a month won't break me, but I don't watch enough TV to really want to spend that.

[To Be Quite Honest]

BTW I just finished Joe Abercombie's First Law Trilogy, absolutely excellent and a must read!


Great book. Bought the second one and looking forward to it!

[Resolute 14]

That's actually a concern of a lot of the fan base. GRRM's getting up there in age, and his books are taking around 5 years each now. The one he just released was the second HALF of book 4, which he supposedly had done years ago. He originally claimed the series would run six books...he just fully finished #4, and the first was put out in August of 1996. So...for him to finish the last two books at his current rate (1/2 a book every 5 years) it'll be 2031 before he's done.

IRRC, it was supposed to be a trilogy at first, then expanded to five, and now seven books. Hopefully he does fit it into seven, because even if he focuses hard on the series now, I'm not sure he'll make it to the end.

[Mike F]

Reminder that Episode 1 goes tonight.

To get you ready, the first part of an extended interview about the series with GRRM (http://tunedin.blogs.time.com/2011/04/15/george-r-r-martin-on-game-of-thrones-from-book-to-tv/) and a good article previewing the series (http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2065251-1,00.html).

[Bob]

Given the sheer amount of narration involved in the opening of the first book, I thought they did a pretty good job of settings things up, ending the first episode exactly where I thought they would. I wasn't sure about most of the castings initially, but now I think a lot of them were solid choices. Except maybe Khal Drogo--he looks a bit too much like a WWE wrestler with a long beard, but it's not like he has a lot of dialogue.

[Bobblehead]

I was pleased with how true to the story stayed. There didn't seem to be any liberties to try and appeal to a larger audience.

I just wonder how people who haven't read the books would have enjoyed it?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

I was pleased with how true to the story stayed. There didn't seem to be any liberties to try and appeal to a larger audience.

I just wonder how people who haven't read the books would have enjoyed it?

I'll let you know later. I have to go to work but I'm gonna watch it tonight on the PVR.

[FlameOn]

I was pleased with how true to the story stayed. There didn't seem to be any liberties to try and appeal to a larger audience.

I just wonder how people who haven't read the books would have enjoyed it?

Watched it last night and enjoyed it. Though some of backstory was kind of confusing. Not sure why some of the things were happening.

[troutman]

http://www.metacritic.com/tv/game-of-thrones/season-1

[loob job]

Never even heard of this book, thought this was a new flash game i could kill time with at work, lol, looks cool though.

[Komskies]

Is incest a common theme in the novels? I enjoyed the show last night and I'll be watching the series, but the sister loving is a little on the creepy side.

[photon]

Never read the books, should I watch the show? Or read the books first then watch?

[Coys1882]

Never read the books, should I watch the show? Or read the books first then watch?

I'm 3/4 done the book so I'll watch last night's episode tonight when I get home from work. The whole season is the first book from I've heard so you should be able to pound out enough to get ahead of the episodes.

[Bobblehead]

Never read the books, should I watch the show? Or read the books first then watch?

There haven't been any deviations that I have noticed. So far it seems you are fine doing either.

Although the books are excellent, and you should intend to read them at some point. There is something to be said for imagining the story yourself (apparently I imagined a bit more missionary position than the director).

[Professor Successor]

FWIW, I've been told to read the books first.

But I don't know if I can resist the temptation, especially with everyone talking about it. What will probably happen is I'll buy the books, intend on reading at least the first one, then succumb to just watching the show. After the season finishes, I'll pick up the first book again and read as much of the series as I can before the start of the second season.

[getbak]

HBO has a handy Viewer's Guide on their website: http://viewers-guide.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/map/

It explains who the different families are, who's on whose side, and which families are intermarried and stuff.

[Bob]

HBO has a handy Viewer's Guide on their website: http://viewers-guide.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/map/

It explains who the different families are, who's on whose side, and which families are intermarried and stuff.

It's cool to see whose been cast in the various roles. My memory is a bit fuzzy, but I think Ser Loras was supposed to be quite the pretty boy, and the actor they've chosen doesn't seem to fit that description. I'm also interested to see how tall an actor they found to play The Mountain That Rides, given that the books, IIRC, describe him as nearly eight feet tall. And Jesus, Lancel Lannister totally looks like a girl.

[JayP]

Is incest a common theme in the novels? I enjoyed the show last night and I'll be watching the series, but the sister loving is a little on the creepy side.

The only incest in the books I can think of off hand is Jaime/Cersei and then the Targaryen family (prior to Daenerys and Viserys and all the events of the books/show) mating siblings to maintain a "pure" bloodline (similar to what the Egyptian pharaohs did).

It is worth noting that in the time period the books are based off of, incest wasn't nearly as taboo as it is now. I don't think there was much brother/sister stuff, but 1st cousins were often married due to political marriages (like in this series) and wasn't considered a big deal at all.

[JayP]

It's cool to see whose been cast in the various roles. My memory is a bit fuzzy, but I think Ser Loras was supposed to be quite the pretty boy, and the actor they've chosen doesn't seem to fit that description. I'm also interested to see how tall an actor they found to play The Mountain That Rides, given that the books, IIRC, describe him as nearly eight feet tall. And Jesus, Lancel Lannister totally looks like a girl.

The guy that plays The Mountain (Ser Gregor) is apparently close to 7 feet tall which is a pretty good substitute. Even if he wasn't that tall, it's pretty easy to use clever angles to make an actor look much taller.

[Kybosh]

I'm a fan of the books and have read and re-read them several times. I quite liked the first episode, I think they made a pretty believable world. What hooked me in the books is all the political intrigue and shifting alliances. Hopefully the show keeps up with that theme.

That being said, I think that it may have been confusing for a non-fan to follow the story line. I could see someone unfamiliar with the books going "WTF" during a lot of the episode.

[GreenLantern]

I watched it with a few people that didn't read the books and I had to explain more than a few things. Overall though if you are paying close attention I thought they did a great job of informing the audience.

The Hounds helmet, in the books I always pictured this thing that would just terrify enemies in the battlefield, it looks like it was made of tinfoil and is very hard to see out of.

Arya was one of my favourite characters in the book and I think they just absolutely hit it dead on with her casting/acting in the first episode. So many under lying complicated themes going on and they picked up on all of them, great job. It is pretty obvious that Martin himself was heavily involved with this show.

[mykalberta]

I expected some of the women to be hotter in the show. In the books some of them are described as goddesses and they are fairly meh in the show imo.

[FlameOn]

That being said, I think that it may have been confusing for a non-fan to follow the story line. I could see someone unfamiliar with the books going "WTF" during a lot of the episode.

Being completely new with the series that's exactly how I felt, though the episode was still very entertaining. Pacing seemed a bit fast for me a few other friends who watched the episode to really figure out who's who, connected how and important why.

After watching a bit and reading up on HBOs helper website things make a lot more sense. I'll probably read the book when the season is done.

[MrMastodonFarm]

I'll echo the thoughts of people who are totally new to this world. I just finished watching the first episode, and boy there was a lot of information to sink in, but I really enjoyed it either way. Plenty of gratuitious tit shows is always a plus.

Also... loved the opening credits. One of the coolest opening credit scenes since the Sopranos and Dexter IMO.

[3 Justin 3]

All I have seen is the middle 20 minutes (watching hockey) but damn is the white haired chick fine. Her brother was all over her tits, but damn, for HBO they are sure pushing the tits and ass.

Listening to it on mute right now, but I downloaded it and plan on watching it later on tonight.

Having never read the books, is there lots of action, or is it more or less drama/sex? I'm definitely not expecting another Spartacus, but not sure what kind of a series it is.

[Torture]

All I have seen is the middle 20 minutes (watching hockey) but damn is the white haired chick fine. Her brother was all over her tits, but damn, for HBO they are sure pushing the tits and ass.

Listening to it on mute right now, but I downloaded it and plan on watching it later on tonight.

Having never read the books, is there lots of action, or is it more or less drama/sex? I'm definitely not expecting another Spartacus, but not sure what kind of a series it is.

Action, drama, sex, and an most importantly a struggle for power.

[Mike F]

Having never read the books, is there lots of action, or is it more or less drama/sex? I'm definitely not expecting another Spartacus, but not sure what kind of a series it is.
The sex isn't nearly as prominent as Spartacus - I'd say this will be the most sex filled episode. It's mostly plot/character driven focusing on struggles for power, as Torture said - sometimes they're physical struggles, sometimes political, often simply interpersonal.

The most defining characteristics, though, are that it's very, very dark and completely merciless. Don't want to spoil anything, but this isn't a series that will end with Gandalf, Frodo, the Hobbits, et al. standing around toasting the one companion who didn't make it.

[Codes]

Very impessed with the first episode. It's been a few years since I read the novels, but I thought the show did a good job of bringing people up to speed. In my case it did a great job jogging my memory.

Pretty stoked. I know it's HBO and all, but I was caught off-guard by all of the nudity and sex...not that that's a bad thing!

[kipperfan]

Had never heard of these books nor the show until I saw this thread a while back, ended up PVR'ing the first episode and watching it tonight. Didn't really know what to expect, but have to say I really enjoyed it, will definitely watch again.

[JayP]

Having never read the books, is there lots of action, or is it more or less drama/sex? I'm definitely not expecting another Spartacus, but not sure what kind of a series it is.

It's a bit of everything. Just don't expect too many big, epic war scenes. The wars exist, but the focus is more on the underlying decisions and events that shape the war than the actual battles themselves. There should be enough action to keep people interested though.

[Coys1882]

I expected some of the women to be hotter in the show. In the books some of them are described as goddesses and they are fairly meh in the show imo.

Don't forget that with the show taking place at this point in history, a woman with all her teeth and no facial deformities was a goddess. :D

[mykalberta]

I have read the series once, listened to it on Audible a few times while gaming, and am going to read it again before watching the series back2back.

Also, if it sticks to the first book it gets very sexually graphic with the white haired chick, I am guessing depending on the pace of the show probably episode 3 or 4.

Also please advise, there are alot of themes in this book that many people may find disturbing, for that reason alone I would suggest reading the book first before watching the series so you know what you are getting yourself into.

[Tinordi]

Watched it last night. Was very impressed. I'm new the series, haven't read the books, but I didn't find it hard to follow along. I went through the HBO website listed above and got the picture from the show without missing much so that's good a testament to the writers to explain without using too much expository dialogue the relationships and dynamics at play.

Also the first scene was great and hella creepy. I hope they keep that story line on a slow burn throughout this season and not just as a cheesy gimmick when things get slow.

Hopefully the show has the budget to show many other parts of the world and to potentially show off some monsters without it looking corny.

[WhiteTiger]

Also the first scene was great and hella creepy. I hope they keep that story line on a slow burn throughout this season and not just as a cheesy gimmick when things get slow.

One of the strengths of the books, that I find, is that you are introduced to the BIGGEST BAD right away...and the rest of the books detail how the 'heros' are falling apart instead of the banding together they need. In the last 2 books, it really looks like everything that the 'heros' are doing will be for naught, as the big bad will just roll over them laughing as they refuse to see it coming.

[troutman]

There is a board game (which is reportedly like Diplomacy):

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/6472/a-game-of-thrones

http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic31686_t.jpg (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/image/31686/a-game-of-thrones)

In A Game of Thrones the board game, players take control of one of the great Houses of Westeros. Via resource management, diplomacy, and cunning, they seek to win dominance over the land. Players must give orders to armies, control important characters, gather resources for the coming winter, and survive the onslaught of their enemies. A unique phase mechanic, battle resolution, and special ordering system make for an engaging game in which all players are actively involved at all times.

Also, a RPG:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Game_of_Thrones_(RPG)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/40/GameofthronesRPG.jpg (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/wiki/File:GameofthronesRPG.jpg)

A Game of Thrones is a role-playing game (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/wiki/Role-playing_game) produced by Guardians of Order (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/wiki/Guardians_of_Order) based on the A Song of Ice and Fire (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/wiki/A_Song_of_Ice_and_Fire) fantasy series by George R. R. Martin (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/wiki/George_R._R._Martin). The game is designed to be usable with two RPG systems: the d20 System (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/wiki/D20_System) and the Tri-Stat dX (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/wiki/Tri-Stat_dX) system.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/39953/a-game-of-thrones-the-card-game

http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic438803_t.jpg (http://forum.calgarypuck.com/image/438803/a-game-of-thrones-the-card-game)

"A Living Card Game (LCG) is a game that breaks away from the traditional Collectible Card Game (CCG) model by offering a new fixed card distribution method that still offers the same dynamic customizable, expanding, and constantly evolving game play that makes CCG’s so much fun, but without the blind buy purchase model that has burned out so many players. The end result is an innovative mix that gives you the best of both worlds!

[mykalberta]

The board game is great, it is very similar to diplomacy. Adds enough extra but not so much as to take away from the simplicity which makes Diplomacy great.

[GreenLantern]

Honestly I started getting mad with how many characters Martin kills off, but he introduces so many every book that it balances out.

And there isn't such a thing as a pointless death in this book, it all serves to further the cause, starting with Jon Arryn.. whats this, he was poisoned? By the Lannisters? So it begins.. Interesting.. :D

[GreenLantern]

Watched it last night. Was very impressed. I'm new the series, haven't read the books, but I didn't find it hard to follow along. I went through the HBO website listed above and got the picture from the show without missing much so that's good a testament to the writers to explain without using too much expository dialogue the relationships and dynamics at play.

Also the first scene was great and hella creepy. I hope they keep that story line on a slow burn throughout this season and not just as a cheesy gimmick when things get slow.

Hopefully the show has the budget to show many other parts of the world and to potentially show off some monsters without it looking corny.

Don't keep your hopes up on monsters, at least not for this book.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Honestly I started getting mad with how many characters Martin kills off, but he introduces so many every book that it balances out.

Isn't that part of the genius of his series? With most fantasy novels you know the main characters will never be killed off and therefore any danger for them can be dismissed and the outcome is never in doubt. The plot ends up becoming cliche and predictable. Martin on the other hand keeps the possibility of anything happening in his novels and therefore plot twists that could never have been anticipated occur.

I found him killing off characters to be very refreshing and IMO that and many factors combine to make his books the class of the genre.

[Kybosh]

Isn't that part of the genius of his series? With most fantasy novels you know the main characters will never be killed off and therefore any danger for them can be dismissed and the outcome is never in doubt. The plot ends up becoming cliche and predictable. Martin on the other hand keeps the possibility of anything happening in his novels and therefore plot twists that could never have been anticipated occur.

I found him killing off characters to be very refreshing and IMO that and many factors combine to make his books the class of the genre.

There was one event in the third book that was so shocking that I won't even put it in spoiler tags because it would ruin the surprise.

[Bobblehead]

I think perhaps the title of this thread should mention spoilers, because even the stuff GreenLantern left outside the spoiler tag is a semi-spoiler. Ditto with WhiteTiger before him.

That is one of the great things about his series, what happens is different enough from the standard fare that it is almost impossible to talk about without giving something away.

[WhiteTiger]

I think perhaps the title of this thread should mention spoilers, because even the stuff GreenLantern left outside the spoiler tag is a semi-spoiler. Ditto with WhiteTiger before him.

That is one of the great things about his series, what happens is different enough from the standard fare that it is almost impossible to talk about without giving something away.

Hm, I didn't see what I wrote so much of a spoiler as a sort of inevitability. Saying that everyone in Westros is too busy squabbling for scraps of power among themselves to look North and see the onrushing problem with the White Walkers is kind of like saying the sky is blue. Though, I have read all the books multiple times, so I am trying to keep away from specifics and it may simply seem evident to me while it's a spoiler to others.

[JayP]

I think perhaps the title of this thread should mention spoilers, because even the stuff GreenLantern left outside the spoiler tag is a semi-spoiler. Ditto with WhiteTiger before him.

That is one of the great things about his series, what happens is different enough from the standard fare that it is almost impossible to talk about without giving something away.

I wouldn't really say that. The White Walkers/Others just aren't a focus of the first book. Not for any reason in particular - there's just other stuff going on around the world. I'd liken it to the same as Stannis - while still important to the story as a whole, at the time and scope of the first book he's just not a focus.

This is all speculative anyways as I'm sure there are some changes to the timeline of the books in order to make the series flow better as a TV show. It doesn't seem logical to start the series off with a bang, showing off the White Walkers and then having them disappear for the whole season (while that works just fine for the novels).

[Cecil Terwilliger]

I think perhaps the title of this thread should mention spoilers, because even the stuff GreenLantern left outside the spoiler tag is a semi-spoiler. Ditto with WhiteTiger before him.

That is one of the great things about his series, what happens is different enough from the standard fare that it is almost impossible to talk about without giving something away.

IMHO if people want to talk about the books and the spoilers they should do it in a different thread.

This thread should just be about the TV show.

[Tinordi]

I agree, the above comment in reference to my previous post was too much spoiler for my liking. Although I understand the poster didn't mean to be a spoiler.

[MrMastodonFarm]

IMHO if people want to talk about the books and the spoilers they should do it in a different thread.

This thread should just be about the TV show.

I thought about posting the same thing... then I noticed this thread started as a way for people who liked the books, to talk about the upcoming TV show. It would be silly for a bunch of guys (like me) to expect everyone who has read the books to now exit the thread because the show has started.

I had to avoid The Walking Dead thread for a bit because of the same issue (guys who read the graphic novels), but you just learn which posters to read etc.

[WhiteTiger]

I thought about posting the same thing... then I noticed this thread started as a way for people who liked the books, to talk about the upcoming TV show. It would be silly for a bunch of guys (like me) to expect everyone who has read the books to now exit the thread because the show has started.

I had to avoid The Walking Dead thread for a bit because of the same issue (guys who read the graphic novels), but you just learn which posters to read etc.

I've noticed that the folks who have read the books are being incredibly restrained as well with what they are and are not posting. There are some things...well...let's just say you should be happy that folks are being as spoiler sensitive as they are. If you are so spoiler sensitive that a comment on the overarcing theme of the book is too much of a spoiler...you may just want to keep away from any thread talking about anything to do with the series in general.

You also may need to keep in mind that the first book, the one the show is currently about, was released in August of 1996. It's not unreasonable to assume that most folks with an interest would have read it by now...but it's easy to forget that a new legion of fans who have no clue what we've been talking about for the last 15 years CAN be 'spoiled' in the first place.

[Torture]

I've noticed that the folks who have read the books are being incredibly restrained as well with what they are and are not posting. There are some things...well...let's just say you should be happy that folks are being as spoiler sensitive as they are. If you are so spoiler sensitive that a comment on the overarcing theme of the book is too much of a spoiler...you may just want to keep away from any thread talking about anything to do with the series in general.

You also may need to keep in mind that the first book, the one the show is currently about, was released in August of 1996. It's not unreasonable to assume that most folks with an interest would have read it by now...but it's easy to forget that a new legion of fans who have no clue what we've been talking about for the last 15 years CAN be 'spoiled' in the first place.

Yeah, could you imagine if somebody spoiled....
Eddard Stark's death. I reading reading the book and it was such a shock. IMO that's one of the defining moments where you realize that it isn't your typical fantasy series. Bran's fall was similar but you hadn't really gotten a chance to get attached to him.

Can't wait for it to happen in the show just to see everybody's reaction.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Dammit... those Spoiler tags are so tempting...

[nik-]

I finally watched it last night, but I'll probably avoid this thread just in case haha.

The show is beautiful, they must have spent a fortune on it. Sean Bean really fits these roles.

[Resolute 14]

Dammit... those Spoiler tags are so tempting...

lol. If you haven't read the book, don't click.

[MrMastodonFarm]

lol. If you haven't read the book, don't click.

At first I quoted it to reply with my post... then quickly realized quoting a post removes the spoiler tag. Thankfully caught the fact there was more text there now then before. Didn't ruin it.

For those in the same boat as me... just learn which posters are new to the series and just watching the new show and things might be easier.

[Resolute 14]

In some ways, two threads might be appropriate here: One for those who have read the books, and one for those who haven't. The odds of accidentally spoiling something are pretty good, though I agree that those of us who have read the books have done well so far to not accidentally leak anything important.

Personally, I just can't wait for A Dance With Dragons to hit the stores. Only three months to go!

[Torture]

Dammit... those Spoiler tags are so tempting...

Hah. I knew somebody would do that. If it were me I would have clicked on it anyways and then regretted it.

Apologies if you were tempted but if you were at least you're in on the secret. :D

[Resolute 14]

Finally saw the first episode.... Definitely a jerky storyline, but half the problem is that you are still trying to figure out who is who and what their relationship is. I suspect it will start to flow better as time goes on, but also with so many POV characters, that will be a hallmark of the series, I think.

Some of the actors don't fit my mental images of the characters at all. Notably Cat and Robert. And I already know that any scenes involving Sansa and Joffrey are going to be annoying rather than entertaining... but then I never liked the characters in the books either.

[Resolute 14]

And it took all of one episode for HBO to sign on for a second season. 2.2 million viewers for the opener.

http://www.usatoday.com/life/television/news/2011-04-20-nielchatter20_ST_N.htm

Edit: or perhaps 4.2 million? http://www.macon.com/2011/04/19/1531358/hbo-renews-game-of-thrones-for.html

[Chump]

The 2.2 million is for the first airing while the 4.2 million is the combined number for all three times it was shown on sunday.

[Bobblehead]

Oh there haven't been any major spoilers in the clear. But as was said, this book has been out so long and has been discussed in the occasional book thread so often that it is easy spoil some of the themes that haven't really been revealed yet - often without even realizing it is a spoiler.
When WhiteTiger revealed that the 7 kingdoms were going to abandon the wall while pursuing the fight for the throne, that hasn't been revealed at this point of the TV show. Right now all a first time viewer knows is that there is a baddie, and one guy was so scared he deserted and had his head cut off. It is minor spoiler for sure, but I just wanted to point out the danger before anything important slipped out.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Anyone want to lend or cheaply sell me copies of the books? If you lend them I promise not to destroy them.

Or I'll pay you $5 a book.

[comrade]

Anyone want to lend or cheaply sell me copies of the books? If you lend them I promise not to destroy them.

Or I'll pay you $5 a book.

Library? They've recently ordered more of every book, bumping the totals up to 10-12 for each book. Although you'll probably only have three weeks to read each one...

[Azure]

I actually enjoyed the first episode, even though they had to jump around from storyline to storyline and introduce us to all the characters.

It'll get better as time goes on. It just needs time to come together.

[GreenLantern]

Isn't that part of the genius of his series? With most fantasy novels you know the main characters will never be killed off and therefore any danger for them can be dismissed and the outcome is never in doubt. The plot ends up becoming cliche and predictable. Martin on the other hand keeps the possibility of anything happening in his novels and therefore plot twists that could never have been anticipated occur.

I found him killing off characters to be very refreshing and IMO that and many factors combine to make his books the class of the genre.

It all comes down to personal preference. I prefer to latch on to a character and watch him grow through a dozen books... to each their own.

Not saying it ruined the series for me or anything, I still think it is the best I have ever read..

I will never forget the day Sturm Brightblade died... it was a sad day in grade six.. a sad day indeed.

Sturm Brigthblade is a character from Dragonlance where I started my fantasy novel adventure, if that spoiled anything for you to bad it is a 20 year old book and has no relevance to this thread.


I suggest that you non-bookies start a new thread... for your own safety.

[Bobblehead]

Another strong episode last night. It is really moving the story along.

[Meelapo]

If possible please also tag spoilers from other books and series. I'm working on the Dragonlance books and didn't expect something big in that series to be spoiled here.

[BlackEleven]

I hadn't heard anything about this show or the series of books until this thread popped up. I'm almost exclusively a non-fiction reader -- science, politics, sociology and that type of thing, so it isn't exactly the type of book that would have piqued my interest. Since I love almost all HBO shows I decided to give this a shot though.

I've had the pilot for about a week, but I hadn't had time to watch it since I've had visitors staying with me all week. I finally gave it a go last night.

Wow, I was so intrigued by the opener. Stunning visuals; a complex, twisting plot; and great, rich characters with a ton of back story. I thought the characters and their relationship to each other was very well explained for people like myself that knew nothing going in.

I reminded a bit of the feeling I had when I watched the Wire for the first time. Not in terms of plot at all, but sheer number of characters and the attention required by the viewer reminded me of the way the Wire felt like a novel unfolding on screen.

I will definitely be following this in the future. In fact, going to go watch the second episode right now...

Cheers for turning me on to this CP. And Cheers to HBO for producing what looks to be another winner.

[MrMastodonFarm]

The 2nd episode was amazing. This is some kinda show!

[cznTiburon]

In some ways, two threads might be appropriate here: One for those who have read the books, and one for those who haven't. The odds of accidentally spoiling something are pretty good, though I agree that those of us who have read the books have done well so far to not accidentally leak anything important.

Personally, I just can't wait for A Dance With Dragons to hit the stores. Only three months to go!


I am re-reading the first 4 jsut to be ready for this. Anyone who hasnt read them really should, I don't think there is a better series out there.

I have also been reading a lot of the theories on ADwD and the rest of the series and it souns like its going to be pretty awesome

[Top Shelf]

Wow, really impressed with the first two episodes so far. I am finding that they are really following the book quite well.

The only thing is that I thought in the books Lady Cat was described as a bit better looking :)

Love the little things that are everywhere too, just really well done so far.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Wow, really impressed with the first two episodes so far. I am finding that they are really following the book quite well.

The only thing is that I thought in the books Lady Cat was described as a bit better looking :)

Love the little things that are everywhere too, just really well done so far.

Sean Bean is really doing a fantastic job so far.

The scene where his b*stard son asks about his mother, and Bean responds that the next time they meet he will tell him about her was so damn good. The trembling in his voice... great job by Bean.

[WhiteTiger]

I saw the first episode the other day (A friend records them and I watch them on pvr whenever I get the chance) and overall, I really liked it. The two things that bugged me, though....

I didn't like the relationship change between Jaime and Tyrion a la the brothel scene. That completely changed the nature of the relationship the two of them have in the book, and I'm not sure it's for the better. We'll have to see how it plays out across the series, though.

I also didn't like how they made Daenarys seem so frightened and...'beaten', I guess. In the books, she was a much stronger person even at the very start (taking the horse Drogo gives her for a wild bareback ride around the camp, for instance) and becomes an even stronger one. I guess with where they've 'set' her now, she's got even further to climb up to the strong leader she will become.

[Resolute 14]

On your second point, White Tiger...

I felt that Dany's independent will was beat down in the books too, until she escaped her brother's control. I thought the first episode set that general theme up well, even if it wasn't completely true to the book. I haven't seen the second episode yet (tomorrow), but I expect Viserys exits the scene rapidly, allowing Dany to grow into the strong character she becomes in the book.

[WhiteTiger]

On your second point, White Tiger...

I felt that Dany's independent will was beat down in the books too, until she escaped her brother's control. I thought the first episode set that general theme up well, even if it wasn't completely true to the book. I haven't seen the second episode yet (tomorrow), but I expect Viserys exits the scene rapidly, allowing Dany to grow into the strong character she becomes in the book.

I can see that. It's been some time since I last read Game. Daenarys is pretty much my favorite character (I'm loathe to say that, with Martin's prediliction for killing off characters I like...) so I may be a bit more sensitive to it. I didn't like like the way they did Dany and Drogo's "first ride", either. But, it is in keeping with the theme the show has presented. I also have to say...I'm pretty excited to see what they do to make Visery's exit. I wonder how true they'll stay to the book then. But yeah...thinking more about it, it does make sense. When her brother is gone, she does tend to do her growing in leaps and bounds.

[To Be Quite Honest]

I thought about posting the same thing... then I noticed this thread started as a way for people who liked the books, to talk about the upcoming TV show. It would be silly for a bunch of guys (like me) to expect everyone who has read the books to now exit the thread because the show has started.

I had to avoid The Walking Dead thread for a bit because of the same issue (guys who read the graphic novels), but you just learn which posters to read etc.

I resemble that comment!

[Thor]

Wow, never read the books, remember seeing the thread title in OT forum (thought it was about some video game), saw it on a umm interwebz and it appeared then shortly after on my computer.

AWESOME show, watched ep 1/2 and love it already.

[Ashartus]

I've heard Martin finally finished A Dance with Dragons yesterday. Even though there was a publication date I was still a bit skeptical given his track record with this book, but he came through in the end.

[Resolute 14]

It will be interesting to see how the show handles the diverging story lines in the next few episodes.

The first episode was almost completely set in Winterfell and Pentos.
The second fractured slightly to Winterfell, the Kingsroad and the Dothraki Sea, but ended with Jon Snow arriving at the wall and Catelyn preparing to set out after her husband.

Episode three will then likely have five story lines to follow: Jon and Tyrion at the Wall, The king's party arriving in King's Landing, Catelyn following, Danerys at Dothraki and Robb/Bran at Winterfell.

[Komskies]

The 4 book box set (A Game of Thrones, A Clash of Kings, A Storm of Swords, and A Feast for Crows) is selling for $31.97 on Amazon right now:

http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/0345529057/ref=s9_pop_gw_ir01?pf_rd_m=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=0RXAMJFBNPDHPMHFJ6D5&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=506427871&pf_rd_i=915398

[Azure]

Second episode was amazing.

Every single time it ends I sit there wondering how it went by so fast.

[HPLovecraft]

Just watched episode one. I thought it was pretty good, -- not great -- but good. First episodes are always a little bit jerky, I find, with characters being introduced, etc. Daenarys kind of annoyed me.

[chemgear]

ala Penny Arcade:

http://art.penny-arcade.com/photos/i-DwTVMBd/0/L/i-DwTVMBd-L.jpg

[MrMastodonFarm]

Second episode was amazing.

Every single time it ends I sit there wondering how it went by so fast.

Watched it twice now, first time I've done that for any episode of any TV in a long long time.

[getbak]

This story made me laugh: http://popwatch.ew.com/2011/04/26/game-thrones-florida-podniestrzanski/

A guy was watching Sunday's episode with his cousin when they began to argue over who was going to "win", and it eventually led to a fight and one of the guys was thrown into a window.

No one's quite sure what the "win" they were fighting over refers to. I guess since it's the "Game" of Thrones, there must be a winner.

[Bobblehead]

This story made me laugh: http://popwatch.ew.com/2011/04/26/game-thrones-florida-podniestrzanski/

A guy was watching Sunday's episode with his cousin when they began to argue over who was going to "win", and it eventually led to a fight and one of the guys was thrown into a window.

No one's quite sure what the "win" they were fighting over refers to. I guess since it's the "Game" of Thrones, there must be a winner.

Bwahahaha; in a link from that article, some people are irate with how the episode ended.
Meanwhile those who’ve read the books are practically biting off their tongues to respond to the viewer outrage since Thrones, well, let’s just say this isn’t the most gentle story…

http://popwatch.ew.com/2011/04/25/game-of-thrones-viewer-outrage-over-cute-characters-death/

[SeeBass]

I have to stop being high when I watch it makes it a little tough to follow

[Resolute 14]

Bwahahaha; in a link from that article, some people are irate with how the episode ended.


http://popwatch.ew.com/2011/04/25/game-of-thrones-viewer-outrage-over-cute-characters-death/

Buried in the middle of a spam comment, was the obvious point that people are upset over that, but not Mycah getting killed? Our society is totally effed when you think about it.

[Bobblehead]

Buried in the middle of a spam comment, was the obvious point that people are upset over that, but not Mycah getting killed? Our society is totally effed when you think about it.

I hadn't read the comments....some of those are awesome!

[ernie]

I've enjoyed it. I am reading the series again in advance of the new book and have hit book 3. The only thing I can truly pick out as not being correct in terms of characteristics of major characters is the very beginning when Arya shoots the arrow into the bullseye when Bran was struggling to do so. In book 3 it's mentioned several times in Arya's story that she wishes she had learned the bow and that she wants to learn it.

Clearly a minor point and just really goes to how well they've adapted it to the screen.

[HPLovecraft]

Episode 3 was fantastic! With the characters all set, they were able to move the plot along a little more quickly and fill it full of foreshadowing. A much, much more interesting product as a result. Loved the scene with Stark walking into the throne room, the elevator on the Wall, and the scene with the Spanish lookin' guy tutoring Arya.

[Azure]

Yeah, it keeps getting better and better.

I think its time for me to stop watching and just record all the episodes for the first season, and then watch them all at once.

Cause I can't stand waiting for each episode after I watch the last one.

[Resolute 14]

Sean Bean's mannerisms are so great. I like at the end where he is smiling as he watches Arya practice her "dancing", then the smile suddenly fades as he realizes the meaning of that... and cut to end credits.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Sean Bean's mannerisms are so great. I like at the end where he is smiling as he watches Arya practice her "dancing", then the smile suddenly fades as he realizes the meaning of that... and cut to end credits.

I've never been a huge fan of Sean Bean, I've liked him, but man.. he is amazing in this. I go back again to episode two where he is explaining to his ####### son that next time they meet, they will talk about his mother. The trembling in his voice, the quivering lip... he's doing a fantastic job.

[Azure]

He was like that in LOTR too, IMO. Solid job all around, and it made the 1st movie the best one of the 3.

[TSXCman]

just finished the first 3 episodes. Excellent show so far. I never read the books but I do like the genre and am very entertained.

Makes me a little sad about the Sword of Truth TV show, since the books are my favorite and the show is terribly casted and produced

[dissentowner]

just finished the first 3 episodes. Excellent show so far. I never read the books but I do like the genre and am very entertained.

Makes me a little sad about the Sword of Truth TV show, since the books are my favorite and the show is terribly casted and produced
You really need to read the books! All kinds of awesome. The SOT was brutal, I agree!

[Displaced Flames fan]

Awesome so far, and I haven't read the books....yet.

Here's to Peter Dinklage finally getting some recognition. He is fabulous in this and well...everything he does. Anyone who hasn't seen The Station Agent....do it.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Holy crap, what an episode!

Also, that theme song is fantastic.

[Bob]

So much of the casting for this series is incredible. Tyrion is probably my favourite, though Viserys is spot on as well.

The end of this episode was fantastic.

[diane_phaneuf]

can't decide if the imp or Tommy Carcetti is my favorite character so far

but I loved this episode, the end with Lady Stark in the tavern was fantastic

[HPLovecraft]

just finished the first 3 episodes. Excellent show so far. I never read the books but I do like the genre and am very entertained.

Makes me a little sad about the Sword of Truth TV show, since the books are my favorite and the show is terribly casted and produced

Wait, the Sword of Truth books are your favorite? By Terry Goodkind? And you haven't read George R.R. Martin? Good Lord, man, do yourself a favour, burn that giant, bloated Sword of Truth series you have, and go purchase the Song of Ice and Fire series in its place. Terry Goodkind is brutal. That has to be the absolute worst fantasy series I have ever had the misfortune of purchasing without doing some research first, and I still can't get over the fact that it's being made into a television show. I can't wait for the special hour-long BDSM torture episodes.

[SeeBass]

Wait, the Sword of Truth books are your favorite? By Terry Goodkind? And you haven't read George R.R. Martin? Good Lord, man, do yourself a favour, burn that giant, bloated Sword of Truth series you have, and go purchase the Song of Ice and Fire series in its place. Terry Goodkind is brutal. That has to be the absolute worst fantasy series I have ever had the misfortune of purchasing without doing some research first, and I still can't get over the fact that it's being made into a television show. I can't wait for the special hour-long BDSM torture episodes.

yeah but the chick in it is really really hot.

[Top Shelf]

Just like in the books, Tyrion is my favorite character again. Just an awesome show so far, really liking how they are dealing with introducing some of the back story too.

[Coys1882]

So far I'm loving the series but I have to say thank god I've read the book. If you haven't I encourage you to put the series on ice, read the book and then watch them.

[Luder]

So far I'm loving the series but I have to say thank god I've read the book. If you haven't I encourage you to put the series on ice, read the book and then watch them.

Mine are on the way, Amazon has the books on sale! :D

http://www.amazon.ca/George-Martins-Thrones-4-Book-Boxed/dp/0345529057/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1304954150&sr=8-1

[Machiavelli]

^ Does the TV show reference just the one book (Game of Thrones), or that entire four-book series?

[flambers]

4 books are great, my biggest problem with guy is he most likely will never finish the series. 5th book took for ever to be released.

Any how the series is decent.

[Luder]

^ Does the TV show reference just the one book (Game of Thrones), or that entire four-book series?

To tell you the truth, I have no idea :bag:

[Bobblehead]

^ Does the TV show reference just the one book (Game of Thrones), or that entire four-book series?

The idea is for each book to be a season. Game of Thrones is the first book.

Remember, the (book) series isn't even done yet. And at the pace he is writing, the (TV)series will be caught up before he gets done.

[ernie]

4 books are great, my biggest problem with guy is he most likely will never finish the series. 5th book took for ever to be released.

Any how the series is decent.

Even worse is that from what I've read about Martin is that he is very much a free writer and doesn't have things truly outlined. If he bites it like Jordan did there is a good chance you never see the end of the series in any sort of form. At least book 5 is out this summer.

I'm re-reading the series in anticipation of Book 5 and I'm shocked how little I remember about Book 3. I'm not remembering key plot points at all to the point that if I didn't know better I would say I never read book 3 before.

[FlameOn]

4 books are great, my biggest problem with guy is he most likely will never finish the series. 5th book took for ever to be released.

Any how the series is decent.

First few books took only a couple of years to write... later books all took a lot longer. Hopefully he picks up the pace for the last two so the TV series can get finished.

[flambers]

First few books took only a couple of years to write... later books all took a lot longer. Hopefully he picks up the pace for the last two so the TV series can get finished.

5th book took 7 years or something like that.....

[flizzenflozz]

Awesome so far, and I haven't read the books....yet.

Here's to Peter Dinklage finally getting some recognition. He is fabulous in this and well...everything he does. Anyone who hasn't seen The Station Agent....do it.

I heard such great things about The Station Agent and watched it about 3 months ago. I HATED it with a passion. That guy who ran the coffee van was unbearable and the dialogue was really, really flat (what little there was).

I found Dinklage's sullen, mopey looks at the camera and his monosyllabic grunts to every comment directed his way excruciating. I'm not sure why people think it is some tour de force but it has been so well received that I feel as though I`m missing something.

Having said that, I think he's much much better in AGOT. His character is very intruiging and I look forward to his appearances throughout the series.

[nik-]

This show is just killin' it.

Haven't read the books so I have no preconceptions about the characters or world and it's great this way. The last scene this week was approaching goose bump territory. Love this show.

[Locke]

I havent watched the third episode yet, but here is my take. I really enjoy this show. I perused this thread and I've read things in Cyrillic that have made more sense to me than this thread.

That being said, this show has been exceptionally well done and I've really been enjoying it. I might even go out and get the books at some point.

This show is just killin' it.

Haven't read the books so I have no preconceptions about the characters or world and it's great this way. The last scene this week was approaching goose bump territory. Love this show.

Agreed, as a stand alone show its been really good.

[WhiteTiger]

5th book took 7 years or something like that.....

1 - A Game of Thrones ~ Aug 1996
2 - A Clash of Kings ~ Nov 1998
3 - A Storm of Swords ~ Aug 2000
4a - A Feast For Crows ~ Oct 2005
4b - A Dance With Dragons ~ June 2011 (projected)
5 - The Winds of Winter ~ (Eventually)
6 - A Dream of Spring ~ (Hopefully)

[Bobblehead]

Just so folks know, around 2003/2004 GRRM announced that he was done the 4th book but it had gotten too long to publish as is. So he was asked to split it into 2 books. He took a loooong time to do that, and he explained he wanted to separate a the storylines into 2 books rather than interrupt the progression part way through, so he needed to untangle any overlap and guard against anything "spoiler-ish".

So then A Feast for Crows came out.

And now fans have been waiting an additional 6 years for a story that was, at least in theory, initially written at the same time the book in 2005 was published.

While I'm sure it has been rewritten many times over, it sure is frustrating.

[photon]

2/3rds of the way through reading Book 1 and wow, he really doesn't pull any punches.

There better be some good to go along with all the bad at some point.

[WhiteTiger]

2/3rds of the way through reading Book 1 and wow, he really doesn't pull any punches.

There better be some good to go along with all the bad at some point.

That'll depend on how you define "good" against what you want to happen in the book. ;)

[ernie]

2/3rds of the way through reading Book 1 and wow, he really doesn't pull any punches.

There better be some good to go along with all the bad at some point.

Yeah, you better get used to getting hit by those punches.

[GreenLantern]

Yeah, you better get used to getting hit by those punches.

OMG SPOILER

/wrists


I kept trying to tell myself something good has to happen soon... I kept telling myself..

[photon]

Hm.. eject now and spend more time playing Minecraft? :D

[MrMastodonFarm]

Well went ahead and bought Book 1 for the Chapters Kobo app. I agree with what nik- said on the previous page about being new to the series... but couldn't help myself.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Just finished the first book and am caught up with tv show. Very enjoyable on both fronts.

Can't wait for next book and next episode.

[Resolute 14]

2/3rds of the way through reading Book 1 and wow, he really doesn't pull any punches.

There better be some good to go along with all the bad at some point.

I think there was some good around page 200 of the third book... ;)

AGoT was all about setting up the conflicts that define the rest of the series. And as you discovered, Martin pulls no punches on that front.

[GreenLantern]

Keep reading, don't stop believin'!

The thing I liked about Martin is that no one is safe, good or bad everyone has a rocky road. So many characters blur that line between good and evil, while some clearly define their stake.

And when he makes you hate a character, he REALLY makes you hate that character. Hah..

[Kybosh]

And when he makes you hate a character, he REALLY makes you hate that character. Hah..

My favourite thing about this series is that the character profiles are constantly changing. Characters you once hated can become favourites and vice versa. Martin's characters are not stuck in a mold to say the least.

[Ashartus]

Just so folks know, around 2003/2004 GRRM announced that he was done the 4th book but it had gotten too long to publish as is. So he was asked to split it into 2 books. He took a loooong time to do that, and he explained he wanted to separate a the storylines into 2 books rather than interrupt the progression part way through, so he needed to untangle any overlap and guard against anything "spoiler-ish".

So then A Feast for Crows came out.

And now fans have been waiting an additional 6 years for a story that was, at least in theory, initially written at the same time the book in 2005 was published.

While I'm sure it has been rewritten many times over, it sure is frustrating.

I think what happened is he wrote himself into a situation he had trouble getting out of (due to his style of not planning every detail ahead of time) and it took him years to figure out how to solve the problem, compounded by him being something of a perfectionist. Hopefully now that's resolved they'll come out at a more reasonable pace again. I read somewhere that Martin thinks he'll be able to keep up with the series so long as they split the third book (which is extremely long) into two seasons.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

I have a copy of book 1 to lend if anyone wants to read it.

I got it from another CPer and he has ok'd me to pay it forward.

[Resolute 14]

I wonder if the guy playing Hodor ever forgets his lines?

[Mike F]

2/3rds of the way through reading Book 1 and wow, he really doesn't pull any punches.

There better be some good to go along with all the bad at some point.
I never found enough good through the first three books to want to continue on. In fact, the punches got heavier and more frequent, and killed any enjoyment for me.

If the first book isn't your cup of tea tonally, it won't get better.

I'm watching the show more out of curiosity to see how the books are translated.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

I never found enough good through the first three books to want to continue on. In fact, the punches got heavier and more frequent, and killed any enjoyment for me.

If the first book isn't your cup of tea tonally, it won't get better.

I'm watching the show more out of curiosity to see how the books are translated.


It isn't so much the lack of good but the lack of conclusion that concerns me. Nothing ever gets resolved. Every problem just leads into another problem.

I motored through the first book and just borrowed the rest from a friend but I'm concerned I'm going to be disillusioned by the end of the 4th novel.

[ernie]

It's a dark world. Old age is 40 as is mentioned several times with some characters being very old. As the title of the first book suggests you have different competing factions that all want the same thing. You have factions within those factions. People are going to die and a lot of them. I think for the most part the deaths are a natural consequence of the events of the story. They aren't just thrown in because he hasn't killed someone off for a few pages.

It's a dark story with complex characters that are not black and white but rather shades of grey. There isn't a knight in shining armor you know won't die no matter what happens. To me that is what makes the books good. And honestly, I see a lot of good throughout the books from certain characters actions.

[WhiteTiger]

It isn't so much the lack of good but the lack of conclusion that concerns me. Nothing ever gets resolved. Every problem just leads into another problem.

I motored through the first book and just borrowed the rest from a friend but I'm concerned I'm going to be disillusioned by the end of the 4th novel.

Depending on the characters you like, the 4th book is either "ok" or "boring as hell".

[Resolute 14]

Yup, and I have to wonder how HBO will handle seasons 4 and 5 if the series should go that far, as the two books run concurrently.

As far as it all being downers, GRRM has nothing on the Malazan Book of the Fallen.

But I think that is why I like this series... The good guy doesn't always win, and the bad guy doesn't always lose. ASOIAF is so popular because it doesn't follow formula.

[photon]

Well I'll keep reading for now, but everyone who posted to this thread is banned if I end up hating the books.

EDIT: *Listen I should say, listening on audiobook, not reading.

[WhiteTiger]

Well I'll keep reading for now, but everyone who posted to this thread is banned if I end up hating the books.

EDIT: *Listen I should say, listening on audiobook, not reading.

How are the audiobooks? The books themselves are huge, and the few audiobooks I did listen to (granted, many years ago...) cut out quite a bit, to the point where I barely recognized the book I was listening to, despite having read the original material several times.

[photon]

They're unabridged as far as I know, let me check.

EDIT: Yeah, unabridged, 33 hours for Book 1!

They're very well read IMO, some variation in the voices but not too much to be distracting, and no false female voice which sometimes annoys me in audiobooks.

[Resolute 14]

Well I'll keep reading for now, but everyone who posted to this thread is banned if I end up hating the books.

I can't make the joke I want to because it will give away a good portion of the third book. :(

[photon]

Lol I'll try and remember when I get there.

[Mike F]

Well I'll keep reading for now, but everyone who posted to this thread is banned if I end up hating the books.

EDIT: *Listen I should say, listening on audiobook, not reading.
Well, if the first book has you questioning due to its bleakness, I'm going to tell you to quit now and find something more uplifting to do. There's a scene at a banquet in the 3rd book that still turns my stomach and convinced me that GRRM has a sadistic side to him when it comes to his characters and readers, and spelled the end of my interest in the series (though I did finish that book).

[GreenLantern]

Well, if the first book has you questioning due to its bleakness, I'm going to tell you to quit now and find something more uplifting to do. There's a scene at a banquet in the 3rd book that still turns my stomach and convinced me that GRRM has a sadistic side to him when it comes to his characters and readers, and spelled the end of my interest in the series (though I did finish that book).

I can't say I was happy with the events of said scene, but I thought the writing here was superb.

I am actually looking forward to it translating into the HBO series because I have such a clear depiction of how I think it looks in my head. That is one of the few parts of the books I can still remember vividly damn near word for word.

That and a duel between a Mountain and a Viper... now that is the scene I am really waiting for.

[ernie]

I can't say I was happy with the events of said scene, but I thought the writing here was superb.

I am actually looking forward to it translating into the HBO series because I have such a clear depiction of how I think it looks in my head. That is one of the few parts of the books I can still remember vividly damn near word for word.

That and a duel between a Mountain and a Viper... now that is the scene I am really waiting for.

It was a tough scene but one that I think most readers should have predicted and fits with the story. It was brutal and well pretty disgusting but very much fitting with the characters involved.

The books have numerous heartless characters such as The mountain, various Bolton's, various Frey's, the goat etc. that I'm a little surprised the banquet scene turned someone off as brutal as it was.

[Mike F]

It was a tough scene but one that I think most readers should have predicted and fits with the story. It was brutal and well pretty disgusting but very much fitting with the characters involved.

That was my problem and why I didn't bother with the 4th book - it did fit with the story GRRM has decided to tell.

If a guy kicks you in the sack three days a week, you shouldn’t be surprised if that’s how your Monday starts, but you don’t have to like it.

It's a terrible shame, though - it’s such a brilliantly written series in a very rich, well imagined universe. I really, really tried to keep going, but couldn’t suffer through any longer.